no packages for amd64 snapshot

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no packages for amd64 snapshot

Gregory Edigarov-2
Hello list,

is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
snapshot packags from being built?

--
With best regards,
     Gregory Edigarov

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Landry Breuil-4
On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 11:23 AM, Gregory Edigarov
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello list,
>
> is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
> snapshot packags from being built?

The gremlins stole them.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Marc Espie-2
On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 01:25:40PM +0200, Landry Breuil wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 11:23 AM, Gregory Edigarov
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hello list,
> >
> > is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
> > snapshot packags from being built?
>
> The gremlins stole them.
Are you sure ? I thought it was the gnomes.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

patric conant
One more reason to hate Gnome.

On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Marc Espie <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 01:25:40PM +0200, Landry Breuil wrote:
> > On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 11:23 AM, Gregory Edigarov
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > Hello list,
> > >
> > > is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
> > > snapshot packags from being built?
> >
> > The gremlins stole them.
> Are you sure ? I thought it was the gnomes.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

LeviaComm Networks NOC
In reply to this post by Gregory Edigarov-2
On 21-Sep-11 02:23, Gregory Edigarov wrote:
> Hello list,
>
> is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
> snapshot packags from being built?
>
I am seeing this too.  What is going on?  There are packages for other
platforms and none for others.  All the mirrors I have check has
packages for alpha, arm, i386, sh, sparc, and even vax.  If the
compilation of packages has stopped for the new release, then why would
a few platforms have packages and other would not?
Especially some of the more popular platforms.  And if this is an error,
why have there been no packages for over a week now?

The only way I see to move forward would be to either downgrade to 4.9
or compile the damned packages myself.

> --
> With best regards,
>       Gregory Edigarov

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Abel Abraham Camarillo Ojeda-2
On Thu, Sep 22, 2011 at 7:53 PM, LeviaComm Networks <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> The only way I see to move forward would be to either downgrade to 4.9 or
> compile the damned packages myself.
>

Which would be faster than complaining.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

STeve Andre'
In reply to this post by LeviaComm Networks NOC
On 09/22/11 20:53, LeviaComm Networks wrote:

> On 21-Sep-11 02:23, Gregory Edigarov wrote:
>> Hello list,
>>
>> is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
>> snapshot packags from being built?
>>
> I am seeing this too.  What is going on?  There are packages for other
> platforms and none for others.  All the mirrors I have check has
> packages for alpha, arm, i386, sh, sparc, and even vax.  If the
> compilation of packages has stopped for the new release, then why
> would a few platforms have packages and other would not?
> Especially some of the more popular platforms.  And if this is an
> error, why have there been no packages for over a week now?
>
> The only way I see to move forward would be to either downgrade to 4.9
> or compile the damned packages myself.
>
>> --
>> With best regards,
>>       Gregory Edigarov
>
>
You know, you could learn how to do bulk builds yourself, and then be
able to get the absolutely latest packages.  It isn't that hard.  You
could even help out and report problems as you find them.  Become a
participant.

--STeve Andre'

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Amit Kulkarni-5
In reply to this post by LeviaComm Networks NOC
On Thu, Sep 22, 2011 at 7:53 PM, LeviaComm Networks <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> On 21-Sep-11 02:23, Gregory Edigarov wrote:
>>
>> Hello list,
>>
>> is this intentional, or there is some problem that prevents amd64
>> snapshot packags from being built?
>>
> I am seeing this too.  What is going on?  There are packages for other
> platforms and none for others.  All the mirrors I have check has packages
> for alpha, arm, i386, sh, sparc, and even vax.  If the compilation of
> packages has stopped for the new release, then why would a few platforms
> have packages and other would not?
> Especially some of the more popular platforms.  And if this is an error,
why
> have there been no packages for over a week now?
>
> The only way I see to move forward would be to either downgrade to 4.9 or
> compile the damned packages myself.

man dpb

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

ropers
On 23 September 2011 04:46, Amit Kulkarni <[hidden email]> wrote:
> man dpb

While I appreciate the dubious "humour" of these questions repeating
near *every friggin release*, I also award you this badge for your
reply:
http://codinghorror.typepad.com/.a/6a0120a85dcdae970b0128776ff992970c-pi

dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)

For the record:

<http://www.undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20100618041150>
> If you have [the] ports tree source on your system, you can do the following
> to view the dpb man page:
>
>    $ mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/build/dpb3.1 | less

PS: No hard feelings, I hope. ;-)

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Amit Kulkarni-5
>> man dpb
>
> While I appreciate the dubious "humour" of these questions repeating
> near *every friggin release*, I also award you this badge for your
> reply:
> http://codinghorror.typepad.com/.a/6a0120a85dcdae970b0128776ff992970c-pi
>
> dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
> OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
> It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
> typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)

Ahh... you got me...... Guilty as charged. I forget that I have the
ports tree installed and all the rest of stuff.......

This needs a FAQ entry, what say Nick?

thanks

> For the record:
>
> <http://www.undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20100618041150>
>> If you have [the] ports tree source on your system, you can do the
following
>> to view the dpb man page:
>>
>>    $ mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/build/dpb3.1 | less
>
> PS: No hard feelings, I hope. ;-)

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Marc Espie-2
In reply to this post by ropers
On Fri, Sep 23, 2011 at 05:25:29PM +0200, ropers wrote:

> On 23 September 2011 04:46, Amit Kulkarni <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > man dpb
>
> While I appreciate the dubious "humour" of these questions repeating
> near *every friggin release*, I also award you this badge for your
> reply:
> http://codinghorror.typepad.com/.a/6a0120a85dcdae970b0128776ff992970c-pi
>
> dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
> OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
> It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
> typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)

dpb is only used to build packages, Theo said it made little sense
to put it or its manpage in base.

I've been asking for people to redo this part of the faq recently
with little success. (and no, I won't do it. I'm the worst person to
explain this *in a simple way*)

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Stuart Henderson
In reply to this post by ropers
On 2011-09-23, ropers <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 23 September 2011 04:46, Amit Kulkarni <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> man dpb
>
> While I appreciate the dubious "humour" of these questions repeating
> near *every friggin release*, I also award you this badge for your
> reply:
> http://codinghorror.typepad.com/.a/6a0120a85dcdae970b0128776ff992970c-pi
>
> dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
> OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
> It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
> typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)

$ grep ports /usr/src/etc/man.conf
_default        /usr/{share,X11R6,local,ports/infrastructure}/man/

If the ports tree is in the usual place then yes 'man dpb' should display
something. If not then either you didn't merge config updates like you
should, or you're running a system that's old enough that the lack of
snapshot packages isn't a problem.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Nick Holland
In reply to this post by Amit Kulkarni-5
On 09/23/2011 11:32 AM, Amit Kulkarni wrote:

>>> man dpb
>>
>> While I appreciate the dubious "humour" of these questions repeating
>> near *every friggin release*, I also award you this badge for your
>> reply:
>> http://codinghorror.typepad.com/.a/6a0120a85dcdae970b0128776ff992970c-pi
>>
>> dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
>> OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
>> It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
>> typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)
>
> Ahh... you got me...... Guilty as charged. I forget that I have the
> ports tree installed and all the rest of stuff.......
>
> This needs a FAQ entry, what say Nick?

this is not a tool for the masses.
Even if it WERE in base and there were a man page for it, I do not
believe the developers would be interested in having people look at the
FAQ and say, "oooo...cool, I should do this!"

Shoot...the people who started this and several other identical threads
recently aren't able to use a search engine or look in the last week or
two's messages to misc@ to figure this out...you want them to use the
distributed package builder?

Let's once-again answer the original query.
1) The active version of OpenBSD is currently 4.9
2) 5.0 is not out yet.
3) -current is for people who can deal with certain issues, like maybe
no packages available.
4) OpenBSD is in the package transition period, between 4.9, 5.0 and
-current, and packages can and will be erratic here.
(think: -current may have progressed beyond what -release packages can
do, sparc and m68k may still be working on completing -release packages)
5) bad packages are probably worse than no packages.
6) There will be times, like now, when packages may not be available.

Nick.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Marc Espie-2
On Fri, Sep 23, 2011 at 02:19:04PM -0400, Nick Holland wrote:
> this is not a tool for the masses.
> Even if it WERE in base and there were a man page for it, I do not
> believe the developers would be interested in having people look at
> the FAQ and say, "oooo...cool, I should do this!"
>
> Shoot...the people who started this and several other identical
> threads recently aren't able to use a search engine or look in the
> last week or two's messages to misc@ to figure this out...you want
> them to use the distributed package builder?

Depends what we are talking about.

If they're hell-bent about building some packages, dpb *is* the shitz
for any kind of "large" packages build.

It's what's now used for most (I hope ALL) official builds.

In the OpenBSD tradition, I tried really hard to make it very much
foolproof: on a virgin machine with a checkout ports tree (that matches
your binary), if you run "dpb", you will eventually end up with all
binary packages normally built by the ports tree.

That's right, doesn't need no stinking options, just time (and disk space).
In my opinion, it's not more complicated than building ports by hand.
It's a bit like a power-saw vs a normal hand-saw.   Both will do what you
want (cut things). The power-saw will be ways more efficient at it. Both
can cut your hands if you're careless. ;-)

(then again, dpb has a shitloadz of options, but then it also work on
clusters).

I did actually notice I forgot to update ports(7) to remove all older text
about "BULK PACKAGE BUILDING" with the old clunky method, instead of pointing
people directly towards dpb...

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

ropers
In reply to this post by Stuart Henderson
> On 2011-09-23, ropers <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> dpb is not in base, there are no packages, it's not mentioned in the
>> OpenBSD FAQ or Porter's Handbook, and it's not listed at openports.se.
>> It can be found via the googles, but for your average OpenBSD user
>> typing man dpb will do exactly diddly squat. ;-)

On 23 September 2011 18:35, Stuart Henderson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> $ grep ports /usr/src/etc/man.conf
> _default        /usr/{share,X11R6,local,ports/infrastructure}/man/

That's in the source tree, not the ports tree.

> If the ports tree is in the usual place

"If" being the operative word; to quote from undeadly, emphasis added:
> <http://www.undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20100618041150>
>> *If* you have [the] ports tree source on your system, you can do the
following
>> to view the dpb man page:
>>
>>    $ mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/build/dpb3.1 | less

> then yes 'man dpb' should display
> something. If not then either you didn't merge config updates like you
> should,

I'm not 100% sure I fully understand what you're saying -- do you mean
if I'm not running -stable instead of just -release?

> or you're running a system that's old enough that the lack of
> snapshot packages isn't a problem.

I am indeed pretty slow to upgrade -- very slow, actually; and yes,
the lack of snapshot updates isn't a problem that affects me. I just
got into this because I curiously tried man dpb after reading Amit's
post and then started digging. (I'm not trying to start an argument
either; I'm just mildly curious and stuff. ;-) Also, I'm planning to
spend more quality time with my OpenBSD box(es) again; I've neglected
them for too long, I'm ashamed :-| to admit. (Of course there are
reasons, but there always are, so yeah...))

Finally, as I've just discovered, if you're actually running
4.9-release, then that mandoc line from undeadly isn't quite correct
anymore either. After downloading/installing the ports tree, the
correct line for 4.9 would be:

mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/man/man1/dpb.1 | less

regards,
--ropers

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Marc Espie-2
In reply to this post by Stuart Henderson
To put things in perspective, the dpb framework is now about two years old.
It was a bit quirky and experimental until 4.9.

The addition of /usr/ports/infrastructure/man to man.conf  happened a little
before 5.0.

So, people wanting to build packages *for current* should have no problem
accessing that information... if they do, they're probably not fit to
build their own packages anyways.

Another data point: as an OpenBSD developer, I have to *check* to figure out
those things.  See, 5.0 was a done deal for me in august, and there have
been large advances since then.

In reality, people who keep up with binary snapshots have (more or less)
5.0, as far as packages are concerned (unless they were away when we asked
for package testing... but you weren't, right ? right ?)

As far as amd64 goes, I expect Robert will resume building snaps as soon as
he's back home. I don't know if Kiki has been chewing network cables or what.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Stuart Henderson
In reply to this post by ropers
On Sun, 25 Sep 2011 02:25:58 +0100, ropers wrote:

> > If the ports tree is in the usual place
>
> "If" being the operative word; to quote from undeadly, emphasis added:

This thread is about building -current packages from the ports tree, so I think it's a reasonable assumption.

> > then yes 'man dpb' should display
> > something. If not then either you didn't merge config updates like you
> > should,
>
> I'm not 100% sure I fully understand what you're saying -- do you mean
> if I'm not running -stable instead of just -release?

If you're running -current (or 5.0 when it's available) and merged config updates, you'll have this.

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Re: no packages for amd64 snapshot

Ingo Schwarze
In reply to this post by ropers
Hi,

ropers wrote on Sun, Sep 25, 2011 at 03:25:58AM +0200:
>> On 2011-09-23, ropers <[hidden email]> wrote:

>>>    $ mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/build/dpb3.1 | less
> mandoc -Tascii /usr/ports/infrastructure/man/man1/dpb.1 | less

As you keep citing that line from the outdated undeadly article,
here is a side note:  Just make that

  mandoc /usr/ports/infrastructure/man/man1/dpb.1 | less

Sane defaults the OpenBSD way implies "when given no options, do the
most common, fundamental thing", which for mandoc clearly is "just read
the manual".  

With groff, by contrast, you need
  nroff -mandoc -Tascii -c /usr/ports/infrastructure/man/man1/dpb.1 | less
or
  groff -mandoc -mtty-char -Tascii -P -c \
    /usr/ports/infrastructure/man/man1/dpb.1 | less
which doesn't even fit on a line, and when tbl(1) or eqn(1) is
involved, it gets worse and you need pipes.

With mandoc, basically, forget about options, except -Tlint and -Ttree
for debugging the manual source code.

Yours,
  Ingo