Where did the donation money go, Wim?

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Where did the donation money go, Wim?

Theo de Raadt
I have been in commuinication with a few people who have told me
stories that Wim received donations, obviously meant for the OpenBSD
project, collected at European conference tables -- and that this
money has not made it to the OpenBSD project.  These reports are not
coming from people who gave these donatiosn, but from people who
collected them at tables and gave them to Wim to give to the project.

The amounts are not large, but this should not be happening.

These transactions happened after the last time that Wim transferred
money to the project in April 8, 2008.  These transactions could not
have come to the project in any other way that we are aware of, since
the Computer Shop and Wim stopped doing transfers of donation money
directly quite a while back since there were problems with that
system.  There is no other way this money made it to the project that
we can think of.

So Wim, where is the donation money from those events?

therefore, I would like a record of all donation money ever accepted
into the Belgian Bank account on behalf of the OpenBSD project.  You
set up a special Belgian bank account just for this purpose, so I am
certain you can provide me with the official bank statements so that I
can check them over.

I would also like a report about the money ever collected at
conference events.  If you cannot come up with exact figures, I will
accept estimates.

Thank you very much for getting that report to me soon.

I know what you transferred to the project on Dec 15, 2006 and on
April 8, 2008 (when you apparently closed that account), but I do not
believe there is any possible way that the sum of donations for the
entire period could only be so little.  The amount seems extremely
low, basically it boggles the mind to think that the Belgian account
pulled in donations at less than 10% the rate that the replacement
German bank account pulls it in.

All this donation money received by you, of course, was not spent by
you on anything for the OpenBSD project.  How so?  Ok, everyone stay
with me for a second here and let me explain.

When kd85 (Wim's company) was found to be very late in payments to the
Computer Shop, Wim and Austin and I came to an agreement where all the
previous OpenBSD project bills paid by Wim in Europe were requested by
Austin, and then those bills were considered as credit against kd85's
debt.  All the spending kd85 / Wim did in the past which was approved
by me was credited; and thus these things were paid for by the
Computer Shop.  Furthermore, the Computer Shop even accepted some
bills that had not been approved; Austin convinced me to be generous
in this regard.  (The Computer Shop went further, and purchased back
almost all of Wim's old CDs, too, as a credit against his debt).  Yet
even after that operation done last year, kd85's debt still remains
substantial.  Understand what this means -- it means all the things
ever bought for the OpenBSD project in Europe were paid for by the
Computer Shop.

So I ask -- did you buy things for the project out of the Belgian
donation account?  Then, when the Computer Shop came asking for
receipts, did you submit receipts which were in fact paid for by the
donation account, but which the Computer Shop was now credited against
your company's debt?  You will surely say no, but I remain sceptical.
 
I would also like an explanation of why two transactions of 5,000 EUR
were made from the Belgian donation account with an annotation saying
that they were paying for "OpenBSD 4.1".  The sale of OpenBSD CDs was
a kd85 business, and had nothing to do with donations.  So why would
you have transferred money from the donation account to pay for a debt
owed by your business?

ps. If other people know of donations made to Wim since April of last
year, please let me kno

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Re: Where did the donation money go, Wim?

Theo de Raadt
I need to correct a few details.

> I have been in commuinication with a few people who have told me
> stories that Wim received donations, obviously meant for the OpenBSD
> project, collected at European conference tables -- and that this
> money has not made it to the OpenBSD project.  These reports are not
> coming from people who gave these donatiosn, but from people who
> collected them at tables and gave them to Wim to give to the project.
>
> The amounts are not large, but this should not be happening.
>
> These transactions happened after the last time that Wim transferred
> money to the project in April 8, 2008.  These transactions could not
> have come to the project in any other way that we are aware of, since
> the Computer Shop and Wim stopped doing transfers of donation money
> directly quite a while back since there were problems with that
> system.  There is no other way this money made it to the project that
> we can think of.
>
> So Wim, where is the donation money from those events?
>
> therefore, I would like a record of all donation money ever accepted
> into the Belgian Bank account on behalf of the OpenBSD project.  You
> set up a special Belgian bank account just for this purpose, so I am
> certain you can provide me with the official bank statements so that I
> can check them over.
>
> I would also like a report about the money ever collected at
> conference events.  If you cannot come up with exact figures, I will
> accept estimates.
>
> Thank you very much for getting that report to me soon.
>
> I know what you transferred to the project on Dec 15, 2006 and on
> April 8, 2008 (when you apparently closed that account), but I do not
> believe there is any possible way that the sum of donations for the
> entire period could only be so little.  The amount seems extremely
> low, basically it boggles the mind to think that the Belgian account
> pulled in donations at less than 10% the rate that the replacement
> German bank account pulls it in.

I now realize that I cannot exactly tell the source accounts apart
from each other on the statements I have.  But this is hardly
relevant, since I have a mail saying that the donation account was set
up seperately to not confuse it with kd85's business operation
(ie. good fiscal practice).  So the donation account records must be
seperatable, and I want to see them.

> All this donation money received by you, of course, was not spent by
> you on anything for the OpenBSD project.  How so?  Ok, everyone stay
> with me for a second here and let me explain.
>
> When kd85 (Wim's company) was found to be very late in payments to the
> Computer Shop, Wim and Austin and I came to an agreement where all the
> previous OpenBSD project bills paid by Wim in Europe were requested by
> Austin, and then those bills were considered as credit against kd85's
> debt.  All the spending kd85 / Wim did in the past which was approved
> by me was credited; and thus these things were paid for by the
> Computer Shop.  Furthermore, the Computer Shop even accepted some
> bills that had not been approved; Austin convinced me to be generous
> in this regard.  (The Computer Shop went further, and purchased back
> almost all of Wim's old CDs, too, as a credit against his debt).  Yet
> even after that operation done last year, kd85's debt still remains
> substantial.  Understand what this means -- it means all the things
> ever bought for the OpenBSD project in Europe were paid for by the
> Computer Shop.
>
> So I ask -- did you buy things for the project out of the Belgian
> donation account?  Then, when the Computer Shop came asking for
> receipts, did you submit receipts which were in fact paid for by the
> donation account, but which the Computer Shop was now credited against
> your company's debt?  You will surely say no, but I remain sceptical.
>  
> I would also like an explanation of why two transactions of 5,000 EUR
> were made from the Belgian donation account with an annotation saying
> that they were paying for "OpenBSD 4.1".  The sale of OpenBSD CDs was

     these say OPENBSD 4.0 RELEASE PART I dated Feb 28, 2007
               OPENBSD 4.0 RELEASE        dated Mar 19, 2007

Oops, 4.0 not 4.1; a very late payment.  Yet it still is not clear why
the payment was sent to the German donation receiving account.  Austin
and I had to resolve this issue carefully, since I cannot receive
payment for CDs, that is business. the payment was supposed to be made
to the Computer Shop, since it is _CD sales business_ and does not
involve me financially.

> a kd85 business, and had nothing to do with donations.  So why would
> you have transferred money from the donation account to pay for a debt
> owed by your business?

I now see that I cannot discern the exact accounts in use.  But the
final transfer is "OVERBOEKING + CLOSING ACCOUNT" for a total sum of
donations from Europe of 2802.48 EUR, for a long enough time that this
cannot be enough.

And remember I also asked what happened to the conference table
donations given to OpenBSD over the last 10 years?  Those did not pay
OpenBSD project expenses.  Where is that money?

> ps. If other people know of donations made to Wim since April of last
> year, please let me kno

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Re: Where did the donation money go, Wim?

Christian Weisgerber
In reply to this post by Theo de Raadt
Theo de Raadt <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I have been in commuinication with a few people who have told me
> stories that Wim received donations, obviously meant for the OpenBSD
> project, collected at European conference tables -- and that this
> money has not made it to the OpenBSD project.

At all the European conference tables where I've been with Wim over
the years, all the money from T-shirt, poster, CD sales *and* cash
donations went into the same glass jar, and at the end of the day
Wim collected the money.

I don't know what happened afterwards and if Wim's accounting ever
led him to separate out the donations money.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber                          [hidden email]

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Re: Where did the donation money go, Wim?

Owain Ainsworth-2
On Thu, Apr 02, 2009 at 03:13:03PM +0000, Christian Weisgerber wrote:

> Theo de Raadt <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I have been in commuinication with a few people who have told me
> > stories that Wim received donations, obviously meant for the OpenBSD
> > project, collected at European conference tables -- and that this
> > money has not made it to the OpenBSD project.
>
> At all the European conference tables where I've been with Wim over
> the years, all the money from T-shirt, poster, CD sales *and* cash
> donations went into the same glass jar, and at the end of the day
> Wim collected the money.
>
> I don't know what happened afterwards and if Wim's accounting ever
> led him to separate out the donations money.
>

I can't add much more. However, when I helped out at a conference (Linux
Expo Live, held in london last october), similar things happened:

There wasn't much in the way of donations (a few quid here and there for
a lanyard), OpenBSD wasn't a major feature there. On the other hand,
again the money went all went into the same jar with tshirt, cd etc
sales. I've no idea what happened to it.

-0-
--
Larkinson's Law:
        All laws are basically false.

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Re: Where did the donation money go, Wim?

pedro la peu-2
> (Linux Expo Live, held in london last october)

Fun times... though that was a dead, unattended event. At other events
there were eager punters who wanted OpenSSH/OpenBSD t-shirts, posters,
cds, lanyards, soft toys, etc. Lots of 'em.

There was no indication the proceeds were going anywhere other than to
OpenBSD. Not for the buyers or the volunteer sellers.

Sadly said.