USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
11 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Andrius V
Hello,

I installed OpenBSD 4.6 (default install) into USB key (Patriot
Xporter XT 16GB).
However after install computer hangs during POST while USB key is inserted
(I tried several other computers but they also hanged). What have I done wrong?

Regards,
Andrius V

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Guenther
On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 1:21 PM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I installed OpenBSD 4.6 (default install) into USB key (Patriot
> Xporter XT 16GB).
> However after install computer hangs during POST while USB key is inserted
> (I tried several other computers but they also hanged). What have I done wrong?
>

I seem to recall that disabling AHCI (aka SATA) in your BIOS can solve
this. I've had a bunch of BIOSes hang on me like this.

-Nick

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Holland
In reply to this post by Andrius V
Andrius V wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I installed OpenBSD 4.6 (default install) into USB key (Patriot
> Xporter XT 16GB).
> However after install computer hangs during POST while USB key is inserted
> (I tried several other computers but they also hanged). What have I done wrong?
>
> Regards,
> Andrius V

based on the horribly scant and imprecise info provided, I think I can
safely say, "no idea".

However, I have found some USB keys as boot devices don't work in some
computers, however the exact same key and same install works fine on
other computers, and other USB keys work fine on the computer that
didn't work.  Go Figure.  In that case, though, the system booted, but
off its hard disk, it ignored the USB device (though once booted, the
USB device was just fine).

A fair number of newer-than-expected computers just can't boot from
USB effectively.

IF your description is accurate, that it hangs during POST, this is
clearly NOT an OpenBSD problem, as OpenBSD is not yet booted, this is
a hardware/BIOS problem.  A BIOS upgrade might be the first order of
business, twisting knobs in the BIOS setup might be the second.  You
might have a brain-dead BIOS which assumes that all USB devices must
have FAT file systems on 'em, and if that's the case, you are out of
luck.

If you are using "POST" as a cool-sounding buzzword which means "I
didn't get to a command prompt like I wanted to", and that POST
actually completed and the system has started the boot process,nes. I live in a
group home. I play with netbsd.

then depends on where it stopped.  Read through how the OpenBSD
boot process works on i386/amd64 in FAQ14 and see what didn't happen
and give us more detail.

Nick.

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Holland
Nick Holland wrote:
...
> If you are using "POST" as a cool-sounding buzzword which means "I
> didn't get to a command prompt like I wanted to", and that POST
> actually completed and the system has started the boot process,nes. I live in a
> group home. I play with netbsd.

wow, that was a fascinating pasto that was completely unintended and not
noticed before hitting "Send".  I know where it came from, but not sure
how.

I don't work with OpenBSD, I live in a "normal" home, though I probably
belong in a nice padded room with a really long-sleeved jacket.

> then depends on where it stopped.  Read through how the OpenBSD
> boot process works on i386/amd64 in FAQ14 and see what didn't happen
> and give us more detail.
>
> Nick.

What it should have said is hopefully moderately obvious:
> If you are using "POST" as a cool-sounding buzzword which means "I
> didn't get to a command prompt like I wanted to", and that POST
> actually completed and the system has started the boot process,
> then depends on where it stopped.  Read through how the OpenBSD
> boot process works on i386/amd64 in FAQ14 and see what didn't happen
> and give us more detail.

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Holland
Nick Holland wrote:
> Nick Holland wrote:
...
> I don't work with OpenBSD,
gawd.  I can't compose a simple e-mail today.
"I don't work with NetBSD, I do work with OpenBSD".  Sheesh.  I'm
going to bed.

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Robert Bronsdon
In reply to this post by Nick Holland
Don't forget booting from USB is a black art. Different USB keys will
represent themselves in different ways, some keys represent themselves as
USB Floppy drives, some as USB CD-ROM drives.

Some motherboards see USB keys as valid boot media, not all motherboards.

Given your problem is during POST I can't see this being an OpenBSD
problem. One solution could be too install an OS designed to run from a
USB key and test it on the machine then. If it boots you can at least
eliminate the USB key itself as a problem.


--
Using Opera M2: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Andrius V
Hello,

Ok, If you need more information I can give it. I used this flash key
with other OSes successfully (NetBSD, for example). So it is not an
usb key problem. POST means "power on self test" which you see than
computer starts. Motherboard is Jetway JNF76-N1G-LF P (VIA Nano U2300
1GHz, VIA VX800), however, it hanged with all other my motherboards
(Intel X58, AMD 690G chipsets). I tried to disable SATA, AHCI but it
didn't help. It doesn't hang only when I disable usb media as storage
in BIOS (however it can't be bootable then). Installable OpenBSD CD
boots without problems. It appears that BIOS can't recognize USB key
with OpenBSD for some reason.

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:56 AM, Robert Bronsdon <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Don't forget booting from USB is a black art. Different USB keys will
> represent themselves in different ways, some keys represent themselves as
> USB Floppy drives, some as USB CD-ROM drives.
>
> Some motherboards see USB keys as valid boot media, not all motherboards.
>
> Given your problem is during POST I can't see this being an OpenBSD
> problem. One solution could be too install an OS designed to run from a
> USB key and test it on the machine then. If it boots you can at least
> eliminate the USB key itself as a problem.
>
>
> --
> Using Opera M2: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Guenther
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:43 AM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:56 AM, Robert Bronsdon <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Don't forget booting from USB is a black art. Different USB keys will
>> represent themselves in different ways, some keys represent themselves as
>> USB Floppy drives, some as USB CD-ROM drives.
>>
>> Some motherboards see USB keys as valid boot media, not all motherboards.
>>
>> Given your problem is during POST I can't see this being an OpenBSD
>> problem. One solution could be too install an OS designed to run from a
>> USB key and test it on the machine then. If it boots you can at least
>> eliminate the USB key itself as a problem.
>>
>>

> Hello,
>
> Ok, If you need more information I can give it. I used this flash key
> with other OSes successfully (NetBSD, for example). So it is not an
> usb key problem. POST means "power on self test" which you see than
> computer starts. Motherboard is Jetway JNF76-N1G-LF P (VIA Nano U2300
> 1GHz, VIA VX800), however, it hanged with all other my motherboards
> (Intel X58, AMD 690G chipsets). I tried to disable SATA, AHCI but it
> didn't help. It doesn't hang only when I disable usb media as storage
> in BIOS (however it can't be bootable then). Installable OpenBSD CD
> boots without problems. It appears that BIOS can't recognize USB key
> with OpenBSD for some reason.


Wait, do you mean you've installed NetBSD to the disk and had it boot
fine on the same motherboard? In THAT case it's not hanging at POST,
it's hanging just after POST. Are you sure the OpenBSD bootloader
doesn't show itself -at all-? I'm pretty sure the first thing it does
is print its banner, so if that's not even happening the BIOS must be
loading the MBR in a way the OpenBSD MBR doesn't expect somehow.
Perhaps you could try copying the MBR from a USB key with NetBSD over
the USB key with OpenBSD, see if that makes a difference.

Also please don't top post.

-Nick

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Andrius V
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 9:25 AM, Nick Guenther <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:43 AM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:56 AM, Robert Bronsdon <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Don't forget booting from USB is a black art. Different USB keys will
>>> represent themselves in different ways, some keys represent themselves as
>>> USB Floppy drives, some as USB CD-ROM drives.
>>>
>>> Some motherboards see USB keys as valid boot media, not all motherboards.
>>>
>>> Given your problem is during POST I can't see this being an OpenBSD
>>> problem. One solution could be too install an OS designed to run from a
>>> USB key and test it on the machine then. If it boots you can at least
>>> eliminate the USB key itself as a problem.
>>>
>>>
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Ok, If you need more information I can give it. I used this flash key
>> with other OSes successfully (NetBSD, for example). So it is not an
>> usb key problem. POST means "power on self test" which you see than
>> computer starts. Motherboard is Jetway JNF76-N1G-LF P (VIA Nano U2300
>> 1GHz, VIA VX800), however, it hanged with all other my motherboards
>> (Intel X58, AMD 690G chipsets). I tried to disable SATA, AHCI but it
>> didn't help. It doesn't hang only when I disable usb media as storage
>> in BIOS (however it can't be bootable then). Installable OpenBSD CD
>> boots without problems. It appears that BIOS can't recognize USB key
>> with OpenBSD for some reason.
>
>
> Wait, do you mean you've installed NetBSD to the disk and had it boot
> fine on the same motherboard? In THAT case it's not hanging at POST,
> it's hanging just after POST. Are you sure the OpenBSD bootloader
> doesn't show itself -at all-? I'm pretty sure the first thing it does
> is print its banner, so if that's not even happening the BIOS must be
> loading the MBR in a way the OpenBSD MBR doesn't expect somehow.
> Perhaps you could try copying the MBR from a USB key with NetBSD over
> the USB key with OpenBSD, see if that makes a difference.
>
> Also please don't top post.
>
> -Nick
>

Ok, sorry for a top post. NetBSD was installed into that usb key
earlier (and it booted succesfully). I formated it and installed
OpenBSD instead. At boot I see information about CPU and computer
hangs at this point. Hm, I can try to rewrite mbr with other boot
loader. I'll post the results later (after 8-10 hours).

Regards,
Andrius V

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Andrius V
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 9:43 AM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 9:25 AM, Nick Guenther <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:43 AM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 5:56 AM, Robert Bronsdon <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> Don't forget booting from USB is a black art. Different USB keys will
>>>> represent themselves in different ways, some keys represent themselves as
>>>> USB Floppy drives, some as USB CD-ROM drives.
>>>>
>>>> Some motherboards see USB keys as valid boot media, not all motherboards.
>>>>
>>>> Given your problem is during POST I can't see this being an OpenBSD
>>>> problem. One solution could be too install an OS designed to run from a
>>>> USB key and test it on the machine then. If it boots you can at least
>>>> eliminate the USB key itself as a problem.
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> Ok, If you need more information I can give it. I used this flash key
>>> with other OSes successfully (NetBSD, for example). So it is not an
>>> usb key problem. POST means "power on self test" which you see than
>>> computer starts. Motherboard is Jetway JNF76-N1G-LF P (VIA Nano U2300
>>> 1GHz, VIA VX800), however, it hanged with all other my motherboards
>>> (Intel X58, AMD 690G chipsets). I tried to disable SATA, AHCI but it
>>> didn't help. It doesn't hang only when I disable usb media as storage
>>> in BIOS (however it can't be bootable then). Installable OpenBSD CD
>>> boots without problems. It appears that BIOS can't recognize USB key
>>> with OpenBSD for some reason.
>>
>>
>> Wait, do you mean you've installed NetBSD to the disk and had it boot
>> fine on the same motherboard? In THAT case it's not hanging at POST,
>> it's hanging just after POST. Are you sure the OpenBSD bootloader
>> doesn't show itself -at all-? I'm pretty sure the first thing it does
>> is print its banner, so if that's not even happening the BIOS must be
>> loading the MBR in a way the OpenBSD MBR doesn't expect somehow.
>> Perhaps you could try copying the MBR from a USB key with NetBSD over
>> the USB key with OpenBSD, see if that makes a difference.
>>
>> Also please don't top post.
>>
>> -Nick
>>
>
> Ok, sorry for a top post. NetBSD was installed into that usb key
> earlier (and it booted succesfully). I formated it and installed
> OpenBSD instead. At boot I see information about CPU and computer
> hangs at this point. Hm, I can try to rewrite mbr with other boot
> loader. I'll post the results later (after 8-10 hours).
>
> Regards,
> Andrius V
>

I tried to play with usb key yesterday. Yes, when I copied mbr from
the other computer, computers didn't hang anymore. Of course, that mbr
is not suitable to boot OpenBSD as it points to grub which doesn't
exist in this usb key, however I successfully booted OS from CD (boot
hd0a:/bsd). So, I have question. Can I install grub (with ffs
support?) to openbsd from ports or I need to compile it and configure
it manually? Grub manual points that booting method is the same as
NetBSD (however, does it mean that I need to write --type=netbsd or
--type=openbsd?). Thank you in advance.

Regards,
Andrius V

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: USB key with OpenBSD - hangs at POST

Nick Guenther
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 1:00 AM, Andrius V <[hidden email]> wrote:

>>
>
> I tried to play with usb key yesterday. Yes, when I copied mbr from
> the other computer, computers didn't hang anymore. Of course, that mbr
> is not suitable to boot OpenBSD as it points to grub which doesn't
> exist in this usb key, however I successfully booted OS from CD (boot
> hd0a:/bsd). So, I have question. Can I install grub (with ffs
> support?) to openbsd from ports or I need to compile it and configure
> it manually? Grub manual points that booting method is the same as
> NetBSD (however, does it mean that I need to write --type=netbsd or
> --type=openbsd?). Thank you in advance.

Yes, grub is in ports, and it can even read OpenBSD partitions (though
you have to use chainloading because it doesn't call the OpenBSD
kernel right). If you search the mailing list archives
(http://marc.info?l=openbsd-misc) or just google there's results. In
the future, you can find out this sort of information by using `make
search` in the ports tree or, if you don't have an OpenBSD box handy,
from http://openports.se.

-Nick