Re: New laptop recommendations

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Kaya Saman-2
I couldn't say for the compatibility with OpenBSD though I have read
other people running on them, but how about Lenovo??


I've got an X220 which I run a Linux distro on which I'm really happy
with though the i7 CPU does seem to overheat for some reason, though I
seem to have this issue with all laptops I've gone through?? Must be me :-S

- only system that never overheated was my old PowerBook G3 Firewire
running Mac OS 9


I might be remembering wrong but I'm sure I've seen people on the list
running OBSD on X-series Lenovo's so it might be worth a shot unless
anyone else has better suggestions :-)


Regards,


Kaya


On 06/19/18 11:37, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well, every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>
> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>
> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Daniel Gracia-2
I would opt for a Thinkpad. Actually working with a T460s; runs like a
charm. If you are looking for mobility, a T series should fit. If you need
more horsepower take a look at P series.

Of course those are my preferences, YMMV!

Regards.

El mar., 19 jun. 2018 a las 12:41, Rupert Gallagher (<[hidden email]>)
escribió:

> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well, every
> day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>
> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping Apple
> inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you suffer:
> expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad keyboard
> keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>
> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?
>
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Re: New laptop recommendations

Jeffrey Joshua Rollin
Definitely second the ThinkPad recommendations. I have an X230i, bought used, on which I currently run OpenBSD 6.3, and an E550 on which I've used OpenBSD in the past; both run perfectly as of 6.2, except for the fingerprint reader on the X (although to be fair I haven't tried that again recently).

Jeff

⁣Sent from Blue ​

On 19 Jun 2018, 11:51, at 11:51, Daniel Gracia <[hidden email]> wrote:

>I would opt for a Thinkpad. Actually working with a T460s; runs like a
>charm. If you are looking for mobility, a T series should fit. If you
>need
>more horsepower take a look at P series.
>
>Of course those are my preferences, YMMV!
>
>Regards.
>
>El mar., 19 jun. 2018 a las 12:41, Rupert Gallagher
>(<[hidden email]>)
>escribió:
>
>> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well,
>every
>> day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>>
>> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping
>Apple
>> inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you
>suffer:
>> expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad
>keyboard
>> keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>>
>> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?
>>
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Re: New laptop recommendations

Peter Nicolai Mathias Hansteen
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 06:37:18AM -0400, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
>
> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

I myself have worn out a few thinkpads over the years, but my last couple of
laptops have been Clevo rebrands - local outfits tend to slap their own brands
on them, like Multicom in Norway[1] - a more recent model is at[2].

If you can live without the ThinkPad 'clitmouse' (as you probably can since
you're looking for a replacment for a Mac), try searching for "Clevo Notebook 831"
which I think would leave you with something to spare out of your 1500 EUR.

- Peter

[1] https://bsdly.blogspot.com/2017/07/openbsd-and-modern-laptop.html
[2] https://www.multicom.no/multicom-talisa-u831-black-133/cat-p/c100559/p10642670

--
Peter N. M. Hansteen, member of the first RFC 1149 implementation team
http://bsdly.blogspot.com/ http://www.bsdly.net/ http://www.nuug.no/
"Remember to set the evil bit on all malicious network traffic"
delilah spamd[29949]: 85.152.224.147: disconnected after 42673 seconds.

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Gilles Chehade-7
In reply to this post by Jeffrey Joshua Rollin
I love my DELL Latitude E7240 :-)


June 19, 2018 1:01 PM, "Jeffrey Joshua Rollin" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Definitely second the ThinkPad recommendations. I have an X230i, bought used, on which I currently
> run OpenBSD 6.3, and an E550 on which I've used OpenBSD in the past; both run perfectly as of 6.2,
> except for the fingerprint reader on the X (although to be fair I haven't tried that again
> recently).
>
> Jeff
>
> ⁣Sent from Blue ​
>
> On 19 Jun 2018, 11:51, at 11:51, Daniel Gracia <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I would opt for a Thinkpad. Actually working with a T460s; runs like a
>> charm. If you are looking for mobility, a T series should fit. If you
>> need
>> more horsepower take a look at P series.
>>
>> Of course those are my preferences, YMMV!
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> El mar., 19 jun. 2018 a las 12:41, Rupert Gallagher
>> (<[hidden email]>)
>> escribió:
>>
>>> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well,
>>
>> every
>>> day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>>>
>>> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping
>>
>> Apple
>>> inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you
>>
>> suffer:
>>> expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad
>>
>> keyboard
>>> keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>>>
>>> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?


--
Gilles Chehade

https://www.poolp.org                                          @poolpOrg

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Jordan Geoghegan
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
Have you considered one of the Librem laptops by Purism? I hear they're
quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the factory.


On 06/19/18 03:37, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well, every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>
> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>
> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

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Re: New laptop recommendations

lists-2
Tue, 19 Jun 2018 09:59:45 -0700 Jordan Geoghegan <[hidden email]>
> Have you considered one of the Librem laptops by Purism? I hear they're
> quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the factory.

The pinnacle of bullshit talk, utter nonsense, no technical value at all.

> Tue, 19 Jun 2018 06:37:18 -0400 Rupert Gallagher <[hidden email]>
> > I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me
> > well, every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
> >
> > I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping
> > Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make
> > you suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small
> > disk, bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard
> > connectors.
> >
> > I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?  

Advertisements to resurrection crap, no dmesg, no hardware specification.

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Re: New laptop recommendations

quisquous
In reply to this post by Jordan Geoghegan
>On 06/19/18 03:37, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
>
>>I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

>On 06/19, Jordan Geoghegan wrote:
>
>Have you considered one of the Librem laptops by Purism? I hear they're
>quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the factory.

They run OpenBSD fine with some caveats:

https://forums.puri.sm/t/openbsd-on-librem/1080

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Jordan Geoghegan
In reply to this post by lists-2
On 06/19/18 11:20, [hidden email] wrote:
> Tue, 19 Jun 2018 09:59:45 -0700 Jordan Geoghegan <[hidden email]>
>> Have you considered one of the Librem laptops by Purism? I hear they're
>> quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the factory.
> The pinnacle of bullshit talk, utter nonsense, no technical value at all.
>
>
You don't have to be a snarky prick about things-- I don't hear you
making any suggestions or providing any "technical" arguments or giving
reasons for how/why my suggestion is "utter nonsense".
You want a dmesg? You want the stats on the laptop? I'm not your
secretary, you know how to Google. Don't be aggressive just for the sake
of being aggressive.

Cheers,
Jordan

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Patrick Marchand
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
You can get a pretty good refurbished 3th gen thinkpad x1 carbon under 900$.
I've baught two on ebay over the last year,

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Maximilian Pichler
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
I'm quite happy with my Asus Zenbook 3 (UX390UA). It's thinner,
lighter and more powerful than the current MacBooks and costs about
1100 EUR now.

On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 12:37 PM, Rupert Gallagher <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well, every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>
> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>
> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Thomas Frohwein-2
No AMD laptop recommendations in this day and age? Also buying used or
refurbished laptops on eBay is a security risk from the outset - ask
yourself how well you would be at spotting if someone had tampered e.g.
with the webcam or the firmware? With new hardware, you have at least a
reasonable expectation that the package hasn't been opened between
manufacturer and you...

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Patrick Harper
HP EliteBook 745 G2?

--
  Patrick Harper
  [hidden email]

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018, at 09:01, Thomas Frohwein wrote:
> No AMD laptop recommendations in this day and age? Also buying used or
> refurbished laptops on eBay is a security risk from the outset - ask
> yourself how well you would be at spotting if someone had tampered e.g.
> with the webcam or the firmware? With new hardware, you have at least a
> reasonable expectation that the package hasn't been opened between
> manufacturer and you...
>

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Johan Mellberg
Hmm. I have that one and there’s something fishy with the graphics, when I boot the installer (6.3) I just get “static” on the built in screen. No problem with any other OS. I just tried booting OpenBSD as a test so have not investigated further, but consider it a potential issue, it might be just my specimen but then again, maybe not.

Mvh, Johan

Smartphone. Ja... just det.

> 20 juni 2018 kl. 21:36 skrev Patrick Harper <[hidden email]>:
>
> HP EliteBook 745 G2?
>
> --
>  Patrick Harper
>  [hidden email]
>
>> On Wed, 20 Jun 2018, at 09:01, Thomas Frohwein wrote:
>> No AMD laptop recommendations in this day and age? Also buying used or
>> refurbished laptops on eBay is a security risk from the outset - ask
>> yourself how well you would be at spotting if someone had tampered e.g.
>> with the webcam or the firmware? With new hardware, you have at least a
>> reasonable expectation that the package hasn't been opened between
>> manufacturer and you...
>>
>

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Patrick Harper
No drm support for Kaveri in OpenBSD 6.3. There is support in current now so 6.4 should work better when it arrives.

--
  Patrick Harper
  [hidden email]

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018, at 14:03, Johan Mellberg wrote:

> Hmm. I have that one and there’s something fishy with the graphics, when
> I boot the installer (6.3) I just get “static” on the built in screen.
> No problem with any other OS. I just tried booting OpenBSD as a test so
> have not investigated further, but consider it a potential issue, it
> might be just my specimen but then again, maybe not.
>
> Mvh, Johan
> —
> Smartphone. Ja... just det.
>
> > 20 juni 2018 kl. 21:36 skrev Patrick Harper <[hidden email]>:
> >
> > HP EliteBook 745 G2?
> >
> > --
> >  Patrick Harper
> >  [hidden email]
> >
> >> On Wed, 20 Jun 2018, at 09:01, Thomas Frohwein wrote:
> >> No AMD laptop recommendations in this day and age? Also buying used or
> >> refurbished laptops on eBay is a security risk from the outset - ask
> >> yourself how well you would be at spotting if someone had tampered e.g.
> >> with the webcam or the firmware? With new hardware, you have at least a
> >> reasonable expectation that the package hasn't been opened between
> >> manufacturer and you...
> >>
> >

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Thomas Levine
In reply to this post by quisquous
I spoke with Todd Weaver at LibrePlanet about running OpenBSD on Purism.
I suggested that the company install a bunch of operating systems and
post dmesg, but I don't think they have done that yet.

If I remember correctly, he also said he would be happy to provide
a refurbished laptop to a developer for the purpose of confirming that
the hardware works well on OpenBSD.

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Re: New laptop recommendations

bytevolcano
In reply to this post by Jordan Geoghegan
In his defense, you did exactly that which you are accusing him of, not
providing "technical" arguments. "Oh look at this laptop which I've
apparently never used but I'd recommend you look into anyway."

"I hear they're quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the
factory." It sounds like pandering to ideology without technical merit.


As for my recommendation, I've had some decent success with Panasonic
Toughbooks (CF-30 and CF-31 so far). I'll see if I can bring up a dmesg
when I get a chance. They are physically sound units too.

Most stuff seems to work with 6.3 + syspatches on the CF-31 but I can't
work out how to disable the gestures (I don't seem to have a
"mouse.tp.tapping" variable when using wsconsctl(8)).


On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 13:19:55 -0700
Jordan Geoghegan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 06/19/18 11:20, [hidden email] wrote:
> > Tue, 19 Jun 2018 09:59:45 -0700 Jordan Geoghegan <[hidden email]>  
> >> Have you considered one of the Librem laptops by Purism? I hear they're
> >> quite nice, and are running coreboot straight from the factory.  
> > The pinnacle of bullshit talk, utter nonsense, no technical value at all.
> >
> >  
> You don't have to be a snarky prick about things-- I don't hear you
> making any suggestions or providing any "technical" arguments or giving
> reasons for how/why my suggestion is "utter nonsense".
> You want a dmesg? You want the stats on the laptop? I'm not your
> secretary, you know how to Google. Don't be aggressive just for the sake
> of being aggressive.
>
> Cheers,
> Jordan
>

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Flipchan
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
I got the x200 with libreboot and openbsd

On June 19, 2018 10:47:24 AM UTC, Kaya Saman <[hidden email]> wrote:

>I couldn't say for the compatibility with OpenBSD though I have read
>other people running on them, but how about Lenovo??
>
>
>I've got an X220 which I run a Linux distro on which I'm really happy
>with though the i7 CPU does seem to overheat for some reason, though I
>seem to have this issue with all laptops I've gone through?? Must be me
>:-S
>
>- only system that never overheated was my old PowerBook G3 Firewire
>running Mac OS 9
>
>
>I might be remembering wrong but I'm sure I've seen people on the list
>running OBSD on X-series Lenovo's so it might be worth a shot unless
>anyone else has better suggestions :-)
>
>
>Regards,
>
>
>Kaya
>
>
>On 06/19/18 11:37, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
>> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well,
>every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
>>
>> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping
>Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you
>suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk,
>bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
>>
>> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?

--
Take Care Sincerely flipchan layerprox dev
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Re: New laptop recommendations

Patrick Harper
X200 is a bad idea, Core 2 Duos will never get microcode updates for Spectre bugs.

--
  Patrick Harper
  [hidden email]

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018, at 08:30, flipchan wrote:

> I got the x200 with libreboot and openbsd
>
> On June 19, 2018 10:47:24 AM UTC, Kaya Saman <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >I couldn't say for the compatibility with OpenBSD though I have read
> >other people running on them, but how about Lenovo??
> >
> >
> >I've got an X220 which I run a Linux distro on which I'm really happy
> >with though the i7 CPU does seem to overheat for some reason, though I
> >seem to have this issue with all laptops I've gone through?? Must be me
> >:-S
> >
> >- only system that never overheated was my old PowerBook G3 Firewire
> >running Mac OS 9
> >
> >
> >I might be remembering wrong but I'm sure I've seen people on the list
> >running OBSD on X-series Lenovo's so it might be worth a shot unless
> >anyone else has better suggestions :-)
> >
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >
> >Kaya
> >
> >
> >On 06/19/18 11:37, Rupert Gallagher wrote:
> >> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well,
> >every day, but is now falling apart, finally.
> >>
> >> I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping
> >Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you
> >suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk,
> >bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors.
> >>
> >> I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?
>
> --
> Take Care Sincerely flipchan layerprox dev

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Re: New laptop recommendations

Rupert Gallagher
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
I looked into all of your comments, and I thank you for it. The coreboot/libreboot way was very tempting, but not competitive pricewise. I no longer have a desktop since the past century, spoiled by three MBPs, and need something robust, light, and performing. I spotted an offer for a new Lenovo T480, i5 series 8, 8GB RAM with an empty slot for easy upgrade, dual storage (!!!) with SSD on m.2 and conventional SATA, dual lithium battery for up to 4 days of work without need to plug the power cord, a 14" display, fingerprint and smartcard reader, and a videocamera. Not happy about the clitmouse, and the meccanical mouse buttons. The best part is the cost: 999€ plus VAT. An MBP with similar specs costs north of 3000€, all soldered in. So long Apple, and hello Lenovo! :-)))

On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 12:37, Rupert Gallagher <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm done with my 10 years old 1200EUR MacBookPro. It served me well, every day, but is now falling apart, finally. I would buy a new one if only Steve Jobs would be alive and keeping Apple inspired. The new models are meticulously designed to make you suffer: expensive, slow cpu, soldered ram, soldered disk, small disk, bad keyboard keys, wifi only, must pay extra for standard connectors. I have 1500EUR for a new laptop. What would you buy with it?
12