OpenBSD Desktop Document

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OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.

www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf

Thanks
Roy

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Will H. Backman
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
Of

> Roy Morris
> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:38 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: OpenBSD Desktop Document
>
> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>
> Thanks
> Roy

How about not making it a PFD.

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Joe S-3
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
Roy Morris wrote:

> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>
> Thanks
> Roy
>
>
1. I'd get rid of the rdate cron job and just turn on openntpd. It's
much more efficient, IMO, and you can easily "set it and forget it."

2. I wouldn't add static host mappings to .ssh/config. I would just add
them to /etc/hosts since that is what it's made for.

3. Add the option of creating a tar file for backing up. You can just
burn this to cd or copy (scp, sftp, ftp, nfs, smb) this to another system.

In general, this is a good start. One more piece of advice, try not to
make the document too narrative, but rather just put in what the user
needs to know to get a desktop working.

Might be good to update for 3.8 too.

-joe

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Peter Hessler
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
don't use rdate, `echo 'ntpd_flags=""' >> /etc/rc.conf.local`  it gives
the user better time, and has less damaging effects on the pool.ntp.org
members.


On Tue, Nov 08, 2005 at 02:38:15PM -0500, Roy Morris wrote:
:I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
:them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
:If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
:
:www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
:
:Thanks
:Roy
:

--
Oh Dad!  We're ALL Devo!

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
In reply to this post by Joe S-3
Joe S wrote:

> Roy Morris wrote:
>
>> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
>> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
>> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>> openntpd
>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>
>> Thanks
>> Roy
>>
>>
> 1. I'd get rid of the rdate cron job and just turn on openntpd. It's
> much more efficient, IMO, and you can easily "set it and forget it."

seems reasonable.

>
> 2. I wouldn't add static host mappings to .ssh/config. I would just
> add them to /etc/hosts since that is what it's made for.

This assumes that everywhere you go you use the same logon name, in my
case I don't. I will mention using either or as it suites the user.

>
> 3. Add the option of creating a tar file for backing up. You can just
> burn this to cd or copy (scp, sftp, ftp, nfs, smb) this to another
> system.

Absolutely, all roads lead to Rome. I will advise the reader they have
the option.

>
> In general, this is a good start. One more piece of advice, try not to
> make the document too narrative, but rather just put in what the user
> needs to know to get a desktop working.
>
> Might be good to update for 3.8 too.
>
> -joe

Agreed. I thought it might be to long winded, I will rework it. The doc
is just a starting point for me
I am going to drop in printing and plan on installing 3.8 to check for
differences.

Cheers
Thanks.

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Darrin Chandler
In reply to this post by Will H. Backman
Will H. Backman wrote:

>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
>>    
>>
>Of
>  
>
>>Roy Morris
>>Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:38 PM
>>To: [hidden email]
>>Subject: OpenBSD Desktop Document
>>
>>I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
>>them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
>>If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>>
>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>
>>Thanks
>>Roy
>>    
>>
>
>How about not making it a PFD.
>
>
>  
>
Thanks for not making *me* say it. ;)

--
Darrin Chandler
[hidden email]
http://www.stilyagin.com/

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
Darrin Chandler wrote:

> Will H. Backman wrote:
>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf
>>>  
>>
>> Of
>>  
>>
>>> Roy Morris
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:38 PM
>>> To: [hidden email]
>>> Subject: OpenBSD Desktop Document
>>>
>>> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
>>> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
>>> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>>>
>>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> Roy
>>>  
>>
>>
>> How about not making it a PFD.
>>
>>
>>  
>>
> Thanks for not making *me* say it. ;)
>
I am going to reformat this document to be text only, and export
versions in ps, pdf, txt, html ... that outta cover it.

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OpenCON 2005

Magne J. Andreassen
In reply to this post by Peter Hessler
I'm surprised that noone have posted any reports on the OpenCON held in
Venice, Italy this weekend. I would like to thank everyone, and
especially the staff and developers for a great and well-arranged
conference. It was well worth the long journey from Norway!

Kudos to the staff for a great event, I hope to make it back next year!

BTW: bringing my computer to BeFed is the second dumbest thing I have
ever done...if I'd only knew... "B-e-f-e-d" probably means something
like "beerme" in Italian, not "beefed" or "be fed". Hey..wait... :)

--
Magne

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

J.C. Roberts-2
In reply to this post by Joe S-3
On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 12:20:02 -0800, Joe S <[hidden email]> wrote:

>Roy Morris wrote:
>> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
>> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
>> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>>
>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>
>> Thanks
>> Roy
>>
>>
>1. I'd get rid of the rdate cron job and just turn on openntpd. It's
>much more efficient, IMO, and you can easily "set it and forget it."

Though I agree for most connections, anyone (still) in a situation where
they are paying per minute fees for connect time would be hosed.

Noting the usage of rdate for those who are not always connected in
addition to openntpd for those who are would be a better approach.

JCR

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Rickard Dahlstrand
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
Roy Morris wrote:

> I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
> them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
> If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>
> Thanks
> Roy
>

Great effort!

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
In reply to this post by J.C. Roberts-2
Roy Morris wrote:

>>>I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
>>>them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
>>>If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
>>>
>>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>>
>>>Thanks
>>>Roy
>>>      
>>>
Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at

www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf

Cheers,
Roy

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

OpenBSD-9
Roy Morris wrote:

>
> Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand
> placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>
> Cheers,
> Roy
>
Hi Roy,

Good document - would it be worth mentioning sudo(8) for all the root tasks?

After using adduser(8) to create an account, just add the following line
to the sudoers file using visudo(8):

username   ALL=(ALL) ALL

HTH

Fred

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
Fred Crowson wrote:

> Roy Morris wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes
>> suggestedand placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
>> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Roy
>>
> Hi Roy,
>
> Good document - would it be worth mentioning sudo(8) for all the root
> tasks?
>
> After using adduser(8) to create an account, just add the following
> line to the sudoers file using visudo(8):
>
> username   ALL=(ALL) ALL
>
> HTH
>
> Fred
>
>
You're most correct Fred. I will add this to the list of things to
change/add

Thanks!
Roy

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

steven mestdagh
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
On Wed, Nov 09, 2005 at 02:41:05PM -0500, Roy Morris wrote:
> Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand
> placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf

This document is no good. A lot of relevant info is missing, and a lot of
useless info is given. And it's also written in a "do this, then that,
but don't think" style.

For example, your part about system tweaks and linux emulation, do you
really think some newbie user will understand this? Besides it works only
on i386. You also got PKG_PATH wrong. And you can just answer yes during
installation to have ntpd started. Using cdrecord with a .tgz? Have you
tried that?

Your section about X11 is very incomplete. For instance, you mention
.xinitrc, later (even in a totally different section) xdm_flags, total
chaos. You suggest people to set DefaultDepth 24, but you don't even say
what this is.

Double check what you write, and ask yourself whether it is well
organized and can be understood by your target audience (that's windows
users, according to the title!) ...

--
steven

Disclaimer: http://www.kuleuven.be/cwis/email_disclaimer.htm

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roy Morris-4
steven mestdagh wrote:

>On Wed, Nov 09, 2005 at 02:41:05PM -0500, Roy Morris wrote:
>  
>
>>Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand
>>placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf
>>    
>>
>
>This document is no good. A lot of relevant info is missing, and a lot of
>useless info is given. And it's also written in a "do this, then that,
>but don't think" style.
>  
>
Thanks for the constructive remarks Steven, the first document
I wrote was too long so a paint by numbers system
was better I thought, obviously you don't :)

>For example, your part about system tweaks and linux emulation, do you
>really think some newbie user will understand this? Besides it works only
>on i386. You also got PKG_PATH wrong. And you can just answer yes during
>installation to have ntpd started. Using cdrecord with a .tgz? Have you
>tried that?
>  
>
The newbie user is not supposed to understand it all, or they
wouldn't need a document to get a desktop up and running.
What do you mean PKG_PATH is wrong? this was copied verbatim
from my system, and it works. .. As for trying
to decide if someone may or may not have done something
during installation (ntpd), I think it's best to assume they didn't and ask
them to change it. compat_linux is i386 that's true. I guess I should
mention that .. thanks!


>Your section about X11 is very incomplete. For instance, you mention
>.xinitrc, later (even in a totally different section) xdm_flags, total
>chaos. You suggest people to set DefaultDepth 24, but you don't even say
>what this is.
>  
>
My section on X11 is incomplete as I am not trying to write a
book on X11, just get them moving. I will fix a valid point you
make about .xinitrc .. it should be .xsession. I use both depending
on if I am using xdm that day :)

_I_ know that DefaultDepth 24 is (was at one time) required for xdm,
so I ask them to enable it. I have updated the document based on
other feedback warning they need to be able to support it.

>Double check what you write, and ask yourself whether it is well
>organized and can be understood by your target audience (that's windows
>users, according to the title!) ...
>  
>
Well organized and understood.. hmmm not sure either are
completely true, but I will continue to strive to meet those goals.

Thanks for you valued input.
Roy

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Adam Douglas
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
I think your doing a great job. It's a good start. Here's my 2 cents on
what I would suggest doing.

1. Add page numbering (i.e. 1 of 2)
2. Add author/contact info.
3. Add version of document and revision # or date.

Also I noticed you updated the document since the first post. This is
great however looks like the PDF version is completely shot. Why do I
say this, because there is no visual structuring of the document like
you had before. I understand having the other formats but what the heck
is the point of having a PDF if one doesn't have those advantages? It's
my 2 cents do what you want with it because it's your document no one
else's.

Best,
Adam

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Roland Dominguez
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
Great document!
Are there any suggested partition sizes for the desktop environment?

I'll try this out on a dell laptop once its finished with some work
it's doing.

roland

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Johan P. Lindström
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
On 11/9/05, Roy Morris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Roy Morris wrote:
>
> >>>I have been working on a document for newbies that helps
> >>>them put together a basic/functional desktop under OpenBSD.
> >>>If anyone has time, I'd like feed back.
> >>>
>
>>>www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf<http://www.openaltern
atives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf>
> >>>
> >>>Thanks
> >>>Roy
> >>>
> >>>
> Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand
> placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
>
>
www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt<http://www.openalternati
ves.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt>
>
www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps<http://www.openalternativ
es.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps>
>
www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf<http://www.openalternati
ves.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf>
>
> Cheers,
> Roy
>
>

Great work, though you may want to have a peek at rotating your pdf, it's in
landscape format.


// Johan

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Don Boling
Johan P. Lindstrvm wrote:
>
> Great work, though you may want to have a peek at rotating your pdf, it's in
> landscape format.
>
>
> // Johan
>  
Hmmm, It opened and printed in protrait for me.

d

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Re: OpenBSD Desktop Document

Lawrence Teo-4
In reply to this post by Roy Morris-4
Roy Morris wrote:
> Thanks to all those that replied. I have made the changes suggestedand
> placed the document as {ps,pdf,txt} at
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.txt
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.ps
> www.openalternatives.com/OpenBSD/OpenBSD-Desktop.pdf

Great work!

May I suggest shortening the tarball extraction command in the
"Installing Open Office 2.0" section...

 From this:

    A. gzip -d Ooo_2.0.0_LinuxIntel_install.tar.gz; \
    tar -xvf Ooo_2.0.0_LinuxIntel_install.tar

To this:

    A. gzip -cd Ooo_2.0.0_LinuxIntel_install.tar.gz | tar xvf -

Less to type, less likely for a newbie user to make mistakes.

And all instances of "Open Office" and "OpenOffice" should be
"OpenOffice.org" if you want to keep things standardized.

Once again, great start!

Lawrence

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