Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

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Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Joseph Mayer
4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two PCIe slots (one one-lane
and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, microSD, HDMI,
UART.

https://www.sifive.com/products/hifive-unleashed/

https://www.crowdsupply.com/microsemi/hifive-unleashed-expansion-board

21 more available in lower link, to the lower right.

Great to see it happen finally.

Joseph

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Peter Kay-5
>4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two >PCIe slots (one one-lane
>and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, >microSD, HDMI,
>UART

Neat, but horribly slow and expensive. Raptor CS, on the other hand, are releasing the POWER9 based Talos II Lite soon, and also (apparently) the bare motherboard without chassis. Info at raptorcs.com

It'll probably still be a bit slow and expensive compared to a Xeon, and it won't work run OpenBSD out of the box, but it is open.

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Karel Gardas
In reply to this post by Joseph Mayer
On Fri, 18 May 2018 02:30:13 -0400
Joseph Mayer <[hidden email]> wrote:

> 4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two PCIe slots (one one-lane
> and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, microSD, HDMI,
> UART.
>
> https://www.sifive.com/products/hifive-unleashed/
>
> https://www.crowdsupply.com/microsemi/hifive-unleashed-expansion-board
>
> 21 more available in lower link, to the lower right.
>
> Great to see it happen finally.

Indeed! RISC-V is making progress. For plain programmers this is probably not yet the right set of hardware as (1) system spec of RISC-V is not finalized yet (IIRC!) and (2) speed of the board CPU is probably lower than speed of Qemu emulation on high-speed xeon CPU.

Also, w.r.t. price, it's a bit prohibitive indeed. IIRC promise was to have both boards on one board and for ~$1000 but I may be mistaken on this. Anyway, this is just first bird and I hope there will be more comming. Especially the promises of Esperanto Technologies look really promising. Future is open and interesting!

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Karel Gardas
In reply to this post by Peter Kay-5
On Fri, 18 May 2018 12:11:49 +0100
Peter Kay <[hidden email]> wrote:

> >4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two >PCIe slots (one one-lane
> >and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, >microSD, HDMI,
> >UART
>
> Neat, but horribly slow and expensive. Raptor CS, on the other hand, are releasing the POWER9 based Talos II Lite soon, and also (apparently) the bare motherboard without chassis. Info at raptorcs.com

Indeed! Very nice offering, especially recent Lite. On the other hand I can't resist but it looks to me more and more like swan's song of POWER world. Such machine should be here 5 years ago at least if not right after demise of Apple from PowerPC world. That to just keep engineering on the platform. Now, OpenBSD is still supporting PPC but just in 32bit and that even on old and drying supply of 64bits Apple's G5s.

Foolish estimation: if you have a set of machines you would need 2 years and 2-3 engineers to work on this platform to get it somewhere. Lot of effort to just support very fragile world of POWER/PowerPC. Even Freescale, err, NXP, err, Qualcom seems to be leaving it for ARM. Why would anyone else stay/support it? IBM is leaving hardware world slowly more to services so you can spent a lot of time and then just wake up one morning finding out that there will be no future POWER chips from IBM anymore -- that's depending on one vendor CPU supply. Fragile position.

'90s taught me that movement is done from the down to up and not from up to down. Intel killed all those nice workstation provides of '90s very slowly, but killed them at the end. It was not Sun/Digital/SGI killing intel together. Intel from the down of slow 486, then Pentium and then final straw was Pentium Pro. Sudenly PCs were faster and there was no need to stay on more expensive nice machines -- except perhaps for software support.

The question is, if something like that can't happen between ARM and Intel and then later on between RISC-V and ARM. For example Cavium's ThunderX2 looks very nice. In RISC-V, please see presentation of Esperanto Technologies (high-speed chips with a lot of various accelerators done on 7nm TSMC).

> It'll probably still be a bit slow and expensive compared to a Xeon, and it won't work run OpenBSD out of the box, but it is open.
>

Yes, open, but do I really need to move back to Linux world? I kind of left it (as main workstation OS) to OpenSolaris recent years migrating from it to OpenBSD. Do I really need to go back to Linux mess? My bet is on ARMv8 and later on RISC-V. I hope both future is more bright than of IBM's hardware division... And life's simply too short to bet/invest a lot of time on yet another architecture and see its failure...

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Peter J. Philipp-3
In reply to this post by Karel Gardas
On Fri, May 18, 2018 at 03:31:51PM +0200, Karel Gardas wrote:

> On Fri, 18 May 2018 02:30:13 -0400
> Joseph Mayer <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > 4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two PCIe slots (one one-lane
> > and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, microSD, HDMI,
> > UART.
> >
> > https://www.sifive.com/products/hifive-unleashed/
> >
> > https://www.crowdsupply.com/microsemi/hifive-unleashed-expansion-board
> >
> > 21 more available in lower link, to the lower right.
> >
> > Great to see it happen finally.
>
> Indeed! RISC-V is making progress. For plain programmers this is probably not yet the right set of hardware as (1) system spec of RISC-V is not finalized yet (IIRC!) and (2) speed of the board CPU is probably lower than speed of Qemu emulation on high-speed xeon CPU.
>
> Also, w.r.t. price, it's a bit prohibitive indeed. IIRC promise was to have both boards on one board and for ~$1000 but I may be mistaken on this. Anyway, this is just first bird and I hope there will be more comming. Especially the promises of Esperanto Technologies look really promising. Future is open and interesting!

Hi!

RISCV really interests me!  But the porting effort for this is probably
above my head.  In the past in risc-v threads I posted a riscv-qemu build
procedure.  I revisited this today and followed my own steps.  After a bit
of trying I finally got it compiled.  I blogged about this experience:

http://www.centroid.eu/blog/c?article=1526665139

Realistically if you want to run BSD on RISCV you can do it through this
way.  You don't need to buy the hardware, unless you're seriously good with
porting.  My emulation was on FreeBSD, thanks to those folks for makign a
bbl available (so I don't have to install FreeBSD and crosscompile).

Best Regards,
-peter

PS: I've been following Talos 2 as well, and really like it but again, that's
the same as with the RISCV issue, I lack the clue to port this.  I'm going
to learn about RISCV assembly first and then perhaps learn about POWER
assembly, perhaps I can build a compiler.  (I have access to POWER hardware,
but will need to ask permission).  Once that is done I'm ready to help
with any porting effort *laugh*.  That's if I don't give up along the way.

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Rupert Gallagher
In reply to this post by Karel Gardas
Everybody loves the idea of an open-source CPU that can be uploaded to an FPGA processor. Anybody from China who starts selling a mini-itx board and an FPGA fast enough to run risc-v will turn the market on its head in 6--10 years, killing both Intel and AMD. ARM is fabless already...
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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Chris Cappuccio
Rupert Gallagher [[hidden email]] wrote:
> Everybody loves the idea of an open-source CPU that can be uploaded to an FPGA processor. Anybody from China who starts selling a mini-itx board and an FPGA fast enough to run risc-v will turn the market on its head in 6--10 years, killing both Intel and AMD. ARM is fabless already...

FPGAs capable of doing anything big take lots of power and generate lots of heat. They are far from ideal as a platform base, but great for testing if your hardware can be described in VHDL or Verilog. The work to go from that to an ASIC is immense and will take significant backing, which makes the industry support for RISC-V rather interesting. Everyone wants royalty-free hardware in their little devices, I can't blame them.

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Re: Open source RISC-V 64bit w ECC RAM & PCIe this summer

Kevin Lo
In reply to this post by Peter J. Philipp-3
On Fri, May 18, 2018 at 08:00:14PM +0200, Peter J. Philipp wrote:

>
> On Fri, May 18, 2018 at 03:31:51PM +0200, Karel Gardas wrote:
> > On Fri, 18 May 2018 02:30:13 -0400
> > Joseph Mayer <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > 4-core (5-core?) 1.5Ghz, 8GB DDR4 ECC RAM, two PCIe slots (one one-lane
> > > and one two-lane PCIe 2.0?), SATA, gigabit ethernet, microSD, HDMI,
> > > UART.
> > >
> > > https://www.sifive.com/products/hifive-unleashed/
> > >
> > > https://www.crowdsupply.com/microsemi/hifive-unleashed-expansion-board
> > >
> > > 21 more available in lower link, to the lower right.
> > >
> > > Great to see it happen finally.
> >
> > Indeed! RISC-V is making progress. For plain programmers this is probably not yet the right set of hardware as (1) system spec of RISC-V is not finalized yet (IIRC!) and (2) speed of the board CPU is probably lower than speed of Qemu emulation on high-speed xeon CPU.
> >
> > Also, w.r.t. price, it's a bit prohibitive indeed. IIRC promise was to have both boards on one board and for ~$1000 but I may be mistaken on this. Anyway, this is just first bird and I hope there will be more comming. Especially the promises of Esperanto Technologies look really promising. Future is open and interesting!
>
> Hi!

Hi Peter,

> RISCV really interests me!  But the porting effort for this is probably
> above my head.  In the past in risc-v threads I posted a riscv-qemu build
> procedure.  I revisited this today and followed my own steps.  After a bit
> of trying I finally got it compiled.  I blogged about this experience:
>
> http://www.centroid.eu/blog/c?article=1526665139

Our emulators/qemu port has already supported RISC-V and it runs quite well.
If you have time maybe you can test the riscv-elf port?

https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-ports&m=152775211718628&w=2

Thanks.

> Realistically if you want to run BSD on RISCV you can do it through this
> way.  You don't need to buy the hardware, unless you're seriously good with
> porting.  My emulation was on FreeBSD, thanks to those folks for makign a
> bbl available (so I don't have to install FreeBSD and crosscompile).
>
> Best Regards,
> -peter
>
> PS: I've been following Talos 2 as well, and really like it but again, that's
> the same as with the RISCV issue, I lack the clue to port this.  I'm going
> to learn about RISCV assembly first and then perhaps learn about POWER
> assembly, perhaps I can build a compiler.  (I have access to POWER hardware,
> but will need to ask permission).  Once that is done I'm ready to help
> with any porting effort *laugh*.  That's if I don't give up along the way.