My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

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Re: My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

Fredrik Staxeng
"Dmitrij D. Czarkoff" <[hidden email]> writes:

>On Mon, 2012-03-12 at 08:55 +0100, Fredrik Staxeng wrote:
>> "Dmitrij D. Czarkoff" <[hidden email]> writes:
>>
>> >So you state that the fact that "if one chooses to use the whole disk,
>> >the whole disk is used" needs further documentation?
>>
>> Once upon a time, mkfs used to make a 10-second pause before starting.
>> That's the way you do it.
>
>That is an answer to the question "How?" (actually a bad one, as if the
>user didn't read messages before hitting [Enter], he probably won't do
>it after doing so), while my statement implied more of "Why?" you didn't
>address at all.

I jumped into the middle here, I know. I think the 10-second delay is
a brilliant solution. Much better than an "are you sure?" question.

I think that there is a large probability that the user will spend that
time  reading the message, and consider whether he really wants to do it.

--
Fredrik Stax\"ang | rot13: [hidden email]
This is all you need to know about vi: ESC : q ! RET

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Re: My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

Janne Johansson-3
2012/3/12 Fredrik Staxeng <[hidden email]>:

>>> >So you state that the fact that "if one chooses to use the whole disk,
>>> >the whole disk is used" needs further documentation?
>>>
>>> Once upon a time, mkfs used to make a 10-second pause before starting.
>>> That's the way you do it.
>>
>>That is an answer to the question "How?" (actually a bad one, as if the
>>user didn't read messages before hitting [Enter], he probably won't do
>>it after doing so), while my statement implied more of "Why?" you didn't
>>address at all.
>
> I jumped into the middle here, I know. I think the 10-second delay is
> a brilliant solution. Much better than an "are you sure?" question.
> I think that there is a large probability that the user will spend that
> time  reading the message, and consider whether he really wants to do it.

And as soon as the first "I spent those 10 seconds reading the
scrollback or web comics, and now my data is gone" has occurred, we
make it 20 seconds. Then 30. And after that, thousands of
installations are delayed by minutes each just to accommodate people
that 1. don't think OS installations warrants backups when mixing and
multibooting and 2. don't read what they answer anyhow...

--
 To our sweethearts and wives.  May they never meet. -- 19th century toast

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Re: My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

Kevin Chadwick-3
In reply to this post by Fredrik Staxeng
On Mon, 12 Mar 2012 08:55:03 +0100
Fredrik Staxeng wrote:

> "Dmitrij D. Czarkoff" <[hidden email]> writes:
>
> >So you state that the fact that "if one chooses to use the whole disk,
> >the whole disk is used" needs further documentation?
>
> Once upon a time, mkfs used to make a 10-second pause before starting.
> That's the way you do it.
>
>

It's a fair point that may be accepted only when a partitiono table
was already there but I can't see anyone spending time for no gain for
the vast majority.

Also the OP wrote over his partition table and not the data.

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Re: My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

Dmitrij D. Czarkoff-2
In reply to this post by Fredrik Staxeng
On Mon, 2012-03-12 at 10:58 +0100, Fredrik Staxeng wrote:
> I think that there is a large probability that the user will spend that
> time  reading the message, and consider whether he really wants to do it.

On Mon, 2012-03-12 at 11:22 +0000, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
> It's a fair point that may be accepted only when a partitiono table
> was already there but I can't see anyone spending time for no gain for
> the vast majority.

The "10 seconds" proposal is supposed to address the problem, that was
the result of hitting [Enter] without reading the question. I believe
the assumption that the user who didn't read anything before hitting the
key would spend this time reading the screen is completely wrong. In the
end, he had indefinite time to read whatever he thought was worth
reading while the installer was waiting for his input.

At the same time this 10 seconds pause would be distracting for the rest
of us. Given the lack of benefit and the small but real drawback this
proposal appears to be more damaging then helpful. (Though still not as
damaging as "Are you sure you really want to hit that key" one.)

--
Dmitrij D. Czarkoff

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Re[2]: My OpenBSD 5.0 installation experience (long rant)

Mo Libden
In reply to this post by Fredrik Staxeng
12 P<P0QQP0 2012, 11:59 P>Q Fredrik Staxeng <[hidden email]>:
> Once upon a time, mkfs used to make a 10-second pause before starting.
> That's the way you do it.

oh, this is B.C.! then some dork will appear on the list saying the 10 sec was
not long enough for him. when you install an OS (in all other cases too by the
way, but let's stay with the point) you need to think. that head of yours are not
just there to put hat on it.

program: i am going to use the whole disk there
user: ok
program: ...using...
user: WTF?! you're writing to the disk now?!

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