Disconnection php4 from the builds.

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Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Robert Nagy
Hi.

A couple of us thing that people should switch to php5
because the php4 ports is not going to be updated.
Everything in the ports tree uses php5 now and we do not
see any reasons to ship whit it.

It is possible that a lot of people are relying on php4
so we are still going to keep it in the tree but we are
not going to build the packages.

If you have objections, please tell me.

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

STeve Andre'
On Saturday 21 October 2006 13:29, Robert Nagy wrote:

> Hi.
>
> A couple of us thing that people should switch to php5
> because the php4 ports is not going to be updated.
> Everything in the ports tree uses php5 now and we do not
> see any reasons to ship whit it.
>
> It is possible that a lot of people are relying on php4
> so we are still going to keep it in the tree but we are
> not going to build the packages.
>
> If you have objections, please tell me.

PHP5 fixed how many problems over PHP4?  People should be
using 5, so this is the right thing to do.  I'd go so far as to remove
PHP 4 right after 4.1 comes out.

--STeve Andre'

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Adam-29
"STeve Andre'" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> PHP5 fixed how many problems over PHP4?

None?

> People should be using 5, so this is the right thing to do.

People "should be using" whatever they need.  And some people need
PHP4.  There is no reason for them to upgrade to 5, so for the people
who have code that doesn't work in 5, there's no incentive to rewrite
it.

> I'd go so far as to remove PHP 4 right after 4.1 comes out.

That's just plain dumb.  It doesn't hurt to leave the port there for
people who need it.

Adam

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

STeve Andre'
On Saturday 21 October 2006 21:06, Adam wrote:

> "STeve Andre'" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > PHP5 fixed how many problems over PHP4?
>
> None?
>
> > People should be using 5, so this is the right thing to do.
>
> People "should be using" whatever they need.  And some people need
> PHP4.  There is no reason for them to upgrade to 5, so for the people
> who have code that doesn't work in 5, there's no incentive to rewrite
> it.
>
> > I'd go so far as to remove PHP 4 right after 4.1 comes out.
>
> That's just plain dumb.  It doesn't hurt to leave the port there for
> people who need it.
>
> Adam

Following that logic, telnetd, rlogind and others should still be
in the tree.

--STeve Andre'

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Adam-29
"STeve Andre'" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Saturday 21 October 2006 21:06, Adam wrote:
> > "STeve Andre'" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > PHP5 fixed how many problems over PHP4?
> >
> > None?
> >
> > > People should be using 5, so this is the right thing to do.
> >
> > People "should be using" whatever they need.  And some people need
> > PHP4.  There is no reason for them to upgrade to 5, so for the people
> > who have code that doesn't work in 5, there's no incentive to rewrite
> > it.
> >
> > > I'd go so far as to remove PHP 4 right after 4.1 comes out.
> >
> > That's just plain dumb.  It doesn't hurt to leave the port there for
> > people who need it.
> >
> > Adam
>
> Following that logic, telnetd, rlogind and others should still be
> in the tree.

Except that those pose security problems, and PHP4 is no more of a
security problem than PHP5.  Removing something because its insecure
is different from removing something just because "STeve" says you
shouldn't use it.

Adam

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

patrick ~
In reply to this post by STeve Andre'


--- STeve Andre' <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Saturday 21 October 2006 21:06, Adam wrote:
> > "STeve Andre'" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > PHP5 fixed how many problems over PHP4?
> >
> > None?
> >
> > > People should be using 5, so this is the right thing to do.
> >
> > People "should be using" whatever they need.  And some people need
> > PHP4.  There is no reason for them to upgrade to 5, so for the people
> > who have code that doesn't work in 5, there's no incentive to rewrite
> > it.
> >
> > > I'd go so far as to remove PHP 4 right after 4.1 comes out.
> >
> > That's just plain dumb.  It doesn't hurt to leave the port there for
> > people who need it.
> >
> > Adam
>
> Following that logic, telnetd, rlogind and others should still be
> in the tree.


Your logic is flawed. You aren't comparing apples
to apples here. Think about it.




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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Todd T. Fries-2
In reply to this post by Robert Nagy
I definately agree with those previously stating that not all php code
supports php5 yet.

phpBB.com states  'running phpBB 2.0.x with PHP5 is not supported'

.. though there is evidence in their changelogs that they are working on
support for php5.

This is definately not the only codebase in the same boat that does not yet
work on php5.

That said, I do agree at some point that php4 should be deprecated.  I'm not
convinced that time is yet.  After OpenBSD 4.1 seems like a good time to me.
For those not tracking current, that would give approximately a year when 4.2
comes out to have things working with php5.

On Saturday 21 October 2006 12:29, Robert Nagy wrote:

> Hi.
>
> A couple of us thing that people should switch to php5
> because the php4 ports is not going to be updated.
> Everything in the ports tree uses php5 now and we do not
> see any reasons to ship whit it.
>
> It is possible that a lot of people are relying on php4
> so we are still going to keep it in the tree but we are
> not going to build the packages.
>
> If you have objections, please tell me.

--
Todd Fries .. [hidden email]

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Marc Balmer-2
Todd T. Fries wrote:

> I definately agree with those previously stating that not all php code
> supports php5 yet.

disconnecting php4 will help them speed up the transition.

> phpBB.com states  'running phpBB 2.0.x with PHP5 is not supported'

phpBB is notorious for security problems of all kinds,  we should
disconnect this to or move it to the mbone category... ;)

> That said, I do agree at some point that php4 should be deprecated.  I'm not
> convinced that time is yet.  After OpenBSD 4.1 seems like a good time to me.
> For those not tracking current, that would give approximately a year when 4.2
> comes out to have things working with php5.

We can wait forever, but PHP4 is not really maintained anymore, do you
realise this?  It puts servers at risk, unnecessary, I'd say.

-mb

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Henning Brauer
* Marc Balmer <[hidden email]> [2006-10-27 19:07]:
> Todd T. Fries wrote:
>
> >I definately agree with those previously stating that not all php code
> >supports php5 yet.
>
> disconnecting php4 will help them speed up the transition.

bullshit.

it leads to pplz building from source, thus having things not visible
for pkg_*, and they won't get updated at all.

yeah, great idea.

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Adam-29
In reply to this post by Marc Balmer-2
Marc Balmer <[hidden email]> wrote:

> We can wait forever, but PHP4 is not really maintained anymore, do you
> realise this?  It puts servers at risk, unnecessary, I'd say.

Yes, it is maintained.  It just like -stable, it gets security fixes, but
doesn't get new features added.  Its no more of a risk to servers than
PHP5 is, or possibly even less since the PHP developers aren't actively
adding new security holes to it like they are with PHP5.

Adam

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Re: Disconnection php4 from the builds.

Toni Mueller-7
In reply to this post by Henning Brauer

Hello,

[ copious cross-posting stripped ]

On Fri, 27.10.2006 at 19:11:32 +0200, Henning Brauer <[hidden email]> wrote:
> * Marc Balmer <[hidden email]> [2006-10-27 19:07]:
> > Todd T. Fries wrote:
> > >I definately agree with those previously stating that not all php code
> > >supports php5 yet.

unfortunately, I have such an example where a large pile of PHP stuff
I'm required to run doesn't work with PHP5.

> > disconnecting php4 will help them speed up the transition.
> bullshit.

I agree with Henning here. Disconnecting PHP4 will, in "my case", only
raise the question about the viability of OpenBSD. I'd rather avoid
that.

> it leads to pplz building from source, thus having things not visible
> for pkg_*, and they won't get updated at all.

Also agreed. Building from source might be the other option.


Best,
--Toni++