Core Dev?

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Core Dev?

Ahmad Bilal
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Can anyone tell me,
Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?

And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd

Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?

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Re: Core Dev?

Luis Coronado-3
What do you mean the “official way of running OpenBSD on AWS”?

-luis

On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 6:25 PM Ahmad Bilal <[hidden email]> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Can anyone tell me,
> Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
>
> And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
>
> Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
>
> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: ProtonMail
> Comment: https://protonmail.com
>
> wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
> FX9BLNsAvLsmKZUEHIV4XnyM2kGe2kK/1uxfbboYD7oK6qnekVIDxRB4KjXz
> xjhdRzlRkqS50DKFgmVT5z2FN34nDgdLRq3K+vO24jpYAWVYrrrgLsZkqpHp
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>
>
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Re: Core Dev?

Consus-2
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On 00:17 Tue 04 Dec, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
> Can anyone tell me,
> Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
>
> And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
>
> Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?

A quote from the source:

> Running whatever is in this repo will propably end up destroying a kitten factory.

So probably not :)

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Re: Core Dev?

Vijay Sankar
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using
OpenBSD at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or more
years ago. Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable
packages at mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say
otherwise, I would think he is a core developer.

On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Can anyone tell me,
> Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
>
> And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
>
> Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
>
> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: ProtonMail
> Comment: https://protonmail.com
>
> wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
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> +cxZXDiMzDbouZAvSqG/60E=
> =5R2I
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
--
Vijay Sankar
ForeTell Technologies Limited
[hidden email]

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Re: Core Dev?

Ahmad Bilal
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Well I wrote to Theo earlier, but still haven't received a reply from him on this (Its been 4 days).

Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market. It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd team on this topic.

Through my earlier email on this list, I found out about Antoine's github, but I'm not sure how reliable he is. It is another thing, that I don't know how to run shell script on EC2, to do what he suggests.

This is a dilemma :/

@Vijay: No need to be sorry. Its cool man. Thanks for the info.




Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.

‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 8:10 AM, Vijay Sankar <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using
> OpenBSD at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or more
> years ago. Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable
> packages at mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say
> otherwise, I would think he is a core developer.
>
> On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
>
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA256
> > Can anyone tell me,
> > Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
> > And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> > https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
> > Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
> > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: ProtonMail
> > Comment: https://protonmail.com
> > wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
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> > +cxZXDiMzDbouZAvSqG/60E=
> > =5R2I
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> --
> Vijay Sankar
> ForeTell Technologies Limited
> [hidden email]

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Re: Core Dev?

Peter J. Philipp-3
On Tue, Dec 04, 2018 at 06:47:55AM +0000, Ahmad Bilal wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Well I wrote to Theo earlier, but still haven't received a reply from him on this (Its been 4 days).
>
> Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market. It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd team on this topic.
>
> Through my earlier email on this list, I found out about Antoine's github, but I'm not sure how reliable he is. It is another thing, that I don't know how to run shell script on EC2, to do what he suggests.
>
> This is a dilemma :/
>
> @Vijay: No need to be sorry. Its cool man. Thanks for the info.

Hi Ahmad,

OpenBSD has in the past always provided a list of developers at the end of
the Release announcement.  Please see here:

https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-announce&m=153987110101242&w=2

I see Antoine on the list.  I don't know if there is a distinction between
a "core developer" and a developer, they both have @openbsd.org addresses.

Another thing you could do is hunt down commit messages in the CVS.  I've
been an openbsd user for quite a long time and meeting OpenBSD devs was
sometimes surprising because I'd never dreamed that I'd run across one.

Best Regards,
-peter

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Re: Core Dev?

Andreas Kusalananda Kähäri-4
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On Tue, Dec 04, 2018 at 06:47:55AM +0000, Ahmad Bilal wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Well I wrote to Theo earlier, but still haven't received a reply from him on this (Its been 4 days).
>
> Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market. It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd team on this topic.
>
> Through my earlier email on this list, I found out about Antoine's github, but I'm not sure how reliable he is. It is another thing, that I don't know how to run shell script on EC2, to do what he suggests.
>
> This is a dilemma :/
>
> @Vijay: No need to be sorry. Its cool man. Thanks for the info.
>
>
>
>
> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>
> ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
> On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 8:10 AM, Vijay Sankar <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using
> > OpenBSD at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or more
> > years ago. Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable
> > packages at mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say
> > otherwise, I would think he is a core developer.
> >
> > On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
> >
> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
[cut]
> >
> > --
> > Vijay Sankar
> > ForeTell Technologies Limited
> > [hidden email]
[cut]

An OpenBSD developer may do other things related to OpenBSD, including
developing projects that are using OpenBSD, or that are for running
OpenBSD in various settings.  This does not automatically mean that
these projects are "endorsed by OpenBSD" or 100% supported.  This is a
good thing, as it would otherwise severely restrict what other public
projects an OpenBSD could be working on.

Cheers,

--
Andreas Kusalananda Kähäri,
National Bioinformatics Infrastructure Sweden (NBIS),
Uppsala University, Sweden.

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Re: Core Dev?

Gilles Chehade-7
In reply to this post by Vijay Sankar
On Mon, Dec 03, 2018 at 08:40:50PM -0600, Vijay Sankar wrote:
> Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using OpenBSD
> at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or more years ago.
> Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable packages at
> mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say otherwise, I
> would think he is a core developer.
>

Being a core developer, whatever that means, does not mean that anything
you write automatically becomes officialy supported by OpenBSD.

That being said you should ask ajacoutot@ because he is a core developer
whatever that means :-)



> On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA256
> >
> > Can anyone tell me,
> > Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
> >
> > And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> > https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
> >
> > Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
> >
> > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: ProtonMail
> > Comment: https://protonmail.com
> >
> > wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
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> > +cxZXDiMzDbouZAvSqG/60E=
> > =5R2I
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> --
> Vijay Sankar
> ForeTell Technologies Limited
> [hidden email]
>

--
Gilles Chehade       @poolpOrg

https://www.poolp.org                 tip me: https://paypal.me/poolpOrg

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Re: Core Dev?

Ahmad Bilal
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Thanks guys. I did see a reference of his name here and there. I just wanted to make sure (and thus asked it here).

I'm sorry, if I have caused any confusion. But my concern is similar to what Andreas said.

I basically want to know if what he has on his github (regarding using openBSD on AWS) is endorsed by the OpenBSD officially?

Or in a 'semi' sense at least i.e., similar to being not well verified/tested/stable etc but works.

@Gilles: I will ask him.


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Re: Core Dev?

Janne Johansson-3
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
> Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market. It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd team on this topic.

One possibility is to read up on how you create AMIs (obsd ones at
that) and make one for yourself. You are not forced to consume someone
elses AMI.

--
May the most significant bit of your life be positive.

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Re: Core Dev?

Marc Espie-2
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On Tue, Dec 04, 2018 at 12:17:20AM +0000, Ahmad Bilal wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Can anyone tell me,
> Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
>
> And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
>
> Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?

There are lots of misconceptions in that email.

There is no core team in OpenBSD.  Only developers.  Most with commit
access.

Antoine is a long-time OpenBSD developer. He wrote a lot of things.
Most of them in cooperation with other people, because he's really good
at working with others.

This appears to by Antoine's github account, yes.

This work is separate from the OpenBSD project.

It's likely it might work.

It isn't official in any capacity.

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Re: Core Dev?

Marc Espie-2
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On Tue, Dec 04, 2018 at 09:52:09AM +0000, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Thanks guys. I did see a reference of his name here and there. I just wanted to make sure (and thus asked it here).

You're probably a *very* occasional user of OpenBSD.

(note that Antoine is the 2nd most prolific contributor to OpenBSD in terms
of # of commits)

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Re: Core Dev?

Ahmad Bilal
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@Janne: Read up where? Link please (if you are referring to anything except that github)

@Marc: Thanks for the information, but based on what you said, what would you consider as 'official' then? Just curious.

And no, I'm not on OpenBSD at all 'yet'. I was basically on CentOS for a long time. Then recently shifted to FreeBSD, and I'm considering to use OpenBSD now (and for foreseeable future)



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Re: Core Dev?

Solene Rapenne
Ahmad Bilal <[hidden email]> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> @Janne: Read up where? Link please (if you are referring to anything except that github)
>
> @Marc: Thanks for the information, but based on what you said, what would you consider as 'official' then? Just curious.
>
> And no, I'm not on OpenBSD at all 'yet'. I was basically on CentOS for a long time. Then recently shifted to FreeBSD, and I'm considering to use OpenBSD now (and for foreseeable future)
>

Everything on the official CVS repository is obviously official

http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/

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Re: Core Dev?

Nick Holland
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On 12/04/18 01:47, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
...
> Does anyone has any suggestions for me?

Yes.  Read your request carefully to yourself...

> I want OpenBSD due to reliability and security issues.

Good plan.

> AWS is the leader in hosting market.

but ... not security.
By that reasoning, we should all be using Windows XP.

> It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd
> team on this topic.

Sometimes "don't", or "if you do, you get to keep all the pieces" is a
good answer.  Sometimes "no comment" is even better.

Hey, I run OpenBSD on a chunk of rented HW myself, but I don't pretend
it is as secure as a real box in my environment that I control.  But I
picked my hosting provider based on ease and support of getting OpenBSD
working, not "leadership".

"cloud" hosting is a bit like living in a building with randomly
assigned people and sharing a bathroom.  You may end up learning things
about others you may not want to know.

Nick.

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Re: Core Dev?

trondd-2
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
On Tue, December 4, 2018 6:50 am, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
>
> @Marc: Thanks for the information, but based on what you said, what would
> you consider as 'official' then? Just curious.
>

Let go of this concept.  These are your systems.  You're the only
official.  If you want to build an AMI for AWS, you have to understand how
that process works then looking at Antoine's scripts to see if that is
what they do is trivial.  If you want security, you have to know what that
means.  "Offical" or not is irrelivant.  You can't avoid your own due
diligence by passing that responsibility onto some imagined authority.

> And no, I'm not on OpenBSD at all 'yet'. I was basically on CentOS for a
> long time. Then recently shifted to FreeBSD, and I'm considering to use
> OpenBSD now (and for foreseeable future)
>

If you're new to OpenBSD, that's great.  But that means you shouldn't be
running anything mission critical on OpenBSD if you don't know much about
it yet.  In which case, experiment.  Run whatever looks reasonably like it
might be good and see what it does.  If it makes a mess, blow it away and
start over.  Read the man pages for the commands a script runs.  Ask
specific questions if it gets down in the weeds and you can't figure out
what something is doing.  There is absolutly no difference in what's
"official" or not.  Stuff works, and is good, or it isn't.  You have to
learn the difference.

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Re: Core Dev?

Bodie-3
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal


On 4.12.2018 07:47, Ahmad Bilal wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Well I wrote to Theo earlier, but still haven't received a reply from
> him on this (Its been 4 days).
>
> Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to
> reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market.
> It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd
> team on this topic.

LOL good one ;-) So strong about security and then leaving machine in
AWS

>
> Through my earlier email on this list, I found out about Antoine's
> github, but I'm not sure how reliable he is. It is another thing, that
> I don't know how to run shell script on EC2, to do what he suggests.
>
> This is a dilemma :/
>
> @Vijay: No need to be sorry. Its cool man. Thanks for the info.
>
>
>
>
> Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>
> ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
> On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 8:10 AM, Vijay Sankar
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using
>> OpenBSD at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or
>> more
>> years ago. Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable
>> packages at mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say
>> otherwise, I would think he is a core developer.
>>
>> On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
>>
>> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> > Hash: SHA256
>> > Can anyone tell me,
>> > Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
>> > And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
>> > https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
>> > Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
>> > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
>> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> > Version: ProtonMail
>> > Comment: https://protonmail.com
>> > wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
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>> > =5R2I
>> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>
>> --
>> Vijay Sankar
>> ForeTell Technologies Limited
>> [hidden email]
>
>
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Re: Core Dev?

Ahmad Bilal
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

@Solene: What does that have anything to do with my questions? I'm sorry if I'm missing something obvious. Please be kind to point it out for me.

@Nick: If you are saying that AWS is that bad, please provide some reasonable proof of it. What are my options otherwise? I'm not in US (rather I'm in India), so my options are quite limited.

Btw Yes, in regards to Cloud hosting, I'm aware of those drawbacks. I do not plan to keep it in the long term. Thanks for the advice btw.

@trondd: Thank you. Indeed this was my thought as well, that security is not a product, but a continuous process. Btw, your advice is well worded, I appreciate it very much.

@Bodie: Its a joy to have been of amusement to you :P

But on a serious note, as I have said to Nick above, if it is really that bad, please prove it to a short extent at least. Any alternative you may have in mind, would be well appreciated as well.


Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.

‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 11:37 PM, Bodie <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 4.12.2018 07:47, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
>
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA256
> > Well I wrote to Theo earlier, but still haven't received a reply from
> > him on this (Its been 4 days).
> > Does anyone has any suggestions for me? I want OpenBSD due to
> > reliability and security issues. AWS is the leader in hosting market.
> > It is only natural to expect at least a FAQ or HOW-TO from openbsd
> > team on this topic.
>
> LOL good one ;-) So strong about security and then leaving machine in
> AWS
>
> > Through my earlier email on this list, I found out about Antoine's
> > github, but I'm not sure how reliable he is. It is another thing, that
> > I don't know how to run shell script on EC2, to do what he suggests.
> > This is a dilemma :/
> > @Vijay: No need to be sorry. Its cool man. Thanks for the info.
> > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> > ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
> > On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 8:10 AM, Vijay Sankar
> > [hidden email] wrote:
> >
> > > Well, (sorry if this is too much information) my kid started using
> > > OpenBSD at a very young age due to Antoine's gCompris package 10 or
> > > more
> > > years ago. Also, there is the very useful subscription for stable
> > > packages at mtier.org. So unless Theo de Raadt or Antoine Jacoutot say
> > > otherwise, I would think he is a core developer.
> > > On 12/3/18 6:17 PM, Ahmad Bilal wrote:
> > >
> > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > > > Hash: SHA256
> > > > Can anyone tell me,
> > > > Is Antoine Jacoutot a core openbsd developer?
> > > > And this is his account (not a impersonator?)
> > > > https://github.com/ajacoutot/aws-openbsd
> > > > Should I take it as a official way of running OpenBSD on AWS?
> > > > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
> > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > > > Version: ProtonMail
> > > > Comment: https://protonmail.com
> > > > wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBceOCRD3irc5ItUgGgAAngIIAJVEZINkE1Md0/OGKeOQ
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> > > > +cxZXDiMzDbouZAvSqG/60E=
> > > > =5R2I
> > > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > >
> > > --
> > > Vijay Sankar
> > > ForeTell Technologies Limited
> > > [hidden email]
> >
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: ProtonMail
> > Comment: https://protonmail.com
> > wsBcBAEBCAAQBQJcBiMZCRD3irc5ItUgGgAArpQH+wYV/hoDraRdIhLb1CQR
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> > R8h5L6Lv8RgMRUDFGzqcV08=
> > =a6RK
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: Core Dev?

Philip Guenther-2
In reply to this post by Marc Espie-2
On Tue, Dec 4, 2018 at 2:47 AM Marc Espie <[hidden email]> wrote:

> (note that Antoine is the 2nd most prolific contributor to OpenBSD in terms
> of # of commits)
>

Sure, Marc, but that's just because Antoine is such a high caliber mole
that 22 years and 22k commits in order to backdoor AWS systems that were
_clearly_ going to happen is completely believable.

Philip Guenther
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Re: Core Dev?

Theo de Raadt-2
In reply to this post by Ahmad Bilal
Why are all of you wasting your own time chatting with Ahmad??

12