Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

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Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Daniel Ouellet
Hi,

This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
use the package on it and even today there was more on it.

Many thanks for this!!!

I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.

I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.

And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.

So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
in use now.

I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
can put OpenBSD on it.

So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
reliable way would be greatly appreciated.

And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
knowing any better.

I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.

I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.

This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.

Many thanks for your time and feedback.

Daniel

PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Kaya Saman-2
Hi, I totally understand the position you're in and sympathize.

I've never heard of Cisco routers being able to run OpenBSD though IOS
is based on BSD as far as I'm aware.

Not a direct solution to your use case but you could always run a
small mini-itx or SBC system behind the Cisco router. You could put it
as a firewall solution and have the OBSD box doing all the major
routing, vlans, firewall (pf) etc... while the Cisco could just simply
forward information between the private and public IP ranges. Or if
using dial-in then you can bridge the OBSD and Cisco then use OBSD as
the PPPoE device....

It is one suggestion in any case though it might not be the most ideal.

Regards,

Kaya

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 5:03 PM Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
> the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
> use the package on it and even today there was more on it.
>
> Many thanks for this!!!
>
> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.
>
> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.
>
> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
> don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
> impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>
> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
> in use now.
>
> I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
> can put OpenBSD on it.
>
> So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
> reliable way would be greatly appreciated.
>
> And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
> small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
> not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
> knowing any better.
>
> I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
> we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
> and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.
>
> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.
>
> This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
> else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.
>
> Many thanks for your time and feedback.
>
> Daniel
>
> PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
> not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.
>

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Jordan Geoghegan-3
In reply to this post by Daniel Ouellet
I don't know much about Cisco hardware, but I've had great luck with the
Edgerouter line of products. I've run my home network on an Edgerouter
Pro for several years now without issue, and have dozens of ER4 and
ER-Lite devices out in the wild.

If you're looking for non-x86 routing solutions, then the Edgerouter is
one of the best bets.

Regards,

Jordan

On 2020-06-23 09:01, Daniel Ouellet wrote:

> Hi,
>
> This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
> the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
> use the package on it and even today there was more on it.
>
> Many thanks for this!!!
>
> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.
>
> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.
>
> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
> don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
> impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>
> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
> in use now.
>
> I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
> can put OpenBSD on it.
>
> So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
> reliable way would be greatly appreciated.
>
> And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
> small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
> not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
> knowing any better.
>
> I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
> we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
> and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.
>
> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.
>
> This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
> else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.
>
> Many thanks for your time and feedback.
>
> Daniel
>
> PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
> not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.
>

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Daniel Ouellet
Thanks

I have run Edge router for a very long time, but that doesn't fit the
marketing bullshit needed. (;

I run my first one as far back as 2015.

https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=144747982003992&w=2

And the new Ubiquiti most likely would have better performance compare
to many old cisco box possibly running OpenBSD.

That's sadly not the goal here.


On 6/23/20 1:40 PM, Jordan Geoghegan wrote:

> I don't know much about Cisco hardware, but I've had great luck with the
> Edgerouter line of products. I've run my home network on an Edgerouter
> Pro for several years now without issue, and have dozens of ER4 and
> ER-Lite devices out in the wild.
>
> If you're looking for non-x86 routing solutions, then the Edgerouter is
> one of the best bets.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jordan
>
> On 2020-06-23 09:01, Daniel Ouellet wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
>> the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
>> use the package on it and even today there was more on it.
>>
>> Many thanks for this!!!
>>
>> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
>> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.
>>
>> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
>> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
>> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
>> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.
>>
>> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
>> don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
>> impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
>> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
>> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>>
>> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
>> in use now.
>>
>> I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
>> can put OpenBSD on it.
>>
>> So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
>> reliable way would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
>> small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
>> not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
>> knowing any better.
>>
>> I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
>> we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
>> and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.
>>
>> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
>> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.
>>
>> This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
>> else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.
>>
>> Many thanks for your time and feedback.
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>> PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
>> not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.
>>
>

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Daniel Ouellet
In reply to this post by Kaya Saman-2
OpenBSD does run on some old Cisco routers, it's been done before. Sure
it's not officially supported nor does it support all the various
interfaces but it's known to work on some.

I am trying to dig up a dmesg showing it too.

Plus Cisco have some firewall type of device that are over price PC that
can run OpenBSD.

Here is an example using the4 old Cisco IDS-4215

https://komlositech.wordpress.com/2018/12/30/revive-a-cisco-ids-into-a-capable-openbsd-firewall/

I was just curious as to what stage it might be now.

I am not saying it make sense to do really power wise for sure.

May be Juniper instead as Juniper is based on FreeBSD anyway and it's an
over price PC with specialize network cards. (; Ok more then that, but
you get the picture I think.

I was just curious as to what it may be running on these days?

Could be Cisco routers, Cisco IDS, Cisco firewall, unless I am mistaken
they also have servers or used too anyway, and why not Juniper gear?

In short any box that appear to be Cisco or Juniper but that have
something different under the hood.

And yes, this is stupid if you look only at what you get compare to
other better choices.

I am not doing it for best performance, but for fell comfortable.

Call it marketing bullshit, because that's exactly what it is! (;

Daniel


On 6/23/20 12:37 PM, Kaya Saman wrote:

> Hi, I totally understand the position you're in and sympathize.
>
> I've never heard of Cisco routers being able to run OpenBSD though IOS
> is based on BSD as far as I'm aware.
>
> Not a direct solution to your use case but you could always run a
> small mini-itx or SBC system behind the Cisco router. You could put it
> as a firewall solution and have the OBSD box doing all the major
> routing, vlans, firewall (pf) etc... while the Cisco could just simply
> forward information between the private and public IP ranges. Or if
> using dial-in then you can bridge the OBSD and Cisco then use OBSD as
> the PPPoE device....
>
> It is one suggestion in any case though it might not be the most ideal.
>
> Regards,
>
> Kaya
>
> On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 5:03 PM Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
>> the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
>> use the package on it and even today there was more on it.
>>
>> Many thanks for this!!!
>>
>> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
>> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.
>>
>> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
>> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
>> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
>> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.
>>
>> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
>> don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
>> impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
>> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
>> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>>
>> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
>> in use now.
>>
>> I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
>> can put OpenBSD on it.
>>
>> So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
>> reliable way would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
>> small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
>> not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
>> knowing any better.
>>
>> I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
>> we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
>> and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.
>>
>> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
>> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.
>>
>> This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
>> else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.
>>
>> Many thanks for your time and feedback.
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>> PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
>> not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.
>>
>

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Kaya Saman-2
Actually you reminded me about the Cisco Voice appliances which are
basically PC servers. If I recall correctly they ran a Linux kernel too.

Unfortunately I never got to play around with the capabilities of one
but you might have some luck with something like that. Of course it
wouldn't be running Call Manager ;-)

- hang on... my memory is slowly coming back (it's been over 10 years
lol), CCM used to also be available as a VM which could be run on
VMware. Maybe the dedicated appliance would be a good choice of hardware
to run OpenBSD on?

The ASA appliances may also be x86 based which could make them a
candidate but with large price tags for new ones I'm not sure if anyone
has tried doing anything crazy with them.


A quick google for the Unified Communication System came up with this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=cisco+call+manager+server&sxsrf=ALeKk03xeYq4NLgIyiUGtaNmoUnR3iaXnQ:1592950661912&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi_7OPS-5jqAhUpTxUIHRbnCOkQ_AUoAXoECA0QAw&biw=1918&bih=955#imgrc=yRjG43cRTHU1nM


You might be really lucky with one of those devices! Hopefully someone
with more experience will chime in and confirm.


Regards,


Kaya


On 2020-06-23 23:03, Daniel Ouellet wrote:

> OpenBSD does run on some old Cisco routers, it's been done before. Sure
> it's not officially supported nor does it support all the various
> interfaces but it's known to work on some.
>
> I am trying to dig up a dmesg showing it too.
>
> Plus Cisco have some firewall type of device that are over price PC that
> can run OpenBSD.
>
> Here is an example using the4 old Cisco IDS-4215
>
> https://komlositech.wordpress.com/2018/12/30/revive-a-cisco-ids-into-a-capable-openbsd-firewall/
>
> I was just curious as to what stage it might be now.
>
> I am not saying it make sense to do really power wise for sure.
>
> May be Juniper instead as Juniper is based on FreeBSD anyway and it's an
> over price PC with specialize network cards. (; Ok more then that, but
> you get the picture I think.
>
> I was just curious as to what it may be running on these days?
>
> Could be Cisco routers, Cisco IDS, Cisco firewall, unless I am mistaken
> they also have servers or used too anyway, and why not Juniper gear?
>
> In short any box that appear to be Cisco or Juniper but that have
> something different under the hood.
>
> And yes, this is stupid if you look only at what you get compare to
> other better choices.
>
> I am not doing it for best performance, but for fell comfortable.
>
> Call it marketing bullshit, because that's exactly what it is! (;
>
> Daniel
>
>
> On 6/23/20 12:37 PM, Kaya Saman wrote:
>> Hi, I totally understand the position you're in and sympathize.
>>
>> I've never heard of Cisco routers being able to run OpenBSD though IOS
>> is based on BSD as far as I'm aware.
>>
>> Not a direct solution to your use case but you could always run a
>> small mini-itx or SBC system behind the Cisco router. You could put it
>> as a firewall solution and have the OBSD box doing all the major
>> routing, vlans, firewall (pf) etc... while the Cisco could just simply
>> forward information between the private and public IP ranges. Or if
>> using dial-in then you can bridge the OBSD and Cisco then use OBSD as
>> the PPPoE device....
>>
>> It is one suggestion in any case though it might not be the most ideal.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Kaya
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 5:03 PM Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> This might be a bit weird question, but I saw the wireguard being put in
>>> the kernel in the last few days and I am very existed abut it oppose to
>>> use the package on it and even today there was more on it.
>>>
>>> Many thanks for this!!!
>>>
>>> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
>>> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.
>>>
>>> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
>>> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
>>> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
>>> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.
>>>
>>> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
>>> don't make them fell good, but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
>>> impression. I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
>>> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
>>> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>>>
>>> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
>>> in use now.
>>>
>>> I really don't care for any special model, or even Juniper, as long as I
>>> can put OpenBSD on it.
>>>
>>> So any feedback as to where it's stand now and what's usable in a
>>> reliable way would be greatly appreciated.
>>>
>>> And yes I know I may well get better performance in some cases with a
>>> small APU device then a Cisco one, but that's for what we all know may
>>> not be logical to be used, but for sadly how some clients may fell, not
>>> knowing any better.
>>>
>>> I guess you can see that as some people do security by obstruction, but
>>> we al know it's not more secure, this is routing by obstruction I guess
>>> and may be less performant, but achieve comfort obstruction confidence.
>>>
>>> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
>>> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.
>>>
>>> This may not go anywhere, however I liked to look even if for nothing
>>> else then just being fun to do if that can't even be usable.
>>>
>>> Many thanks for your time and feedback.
>>>
>>> Daniel
>>>
>>> PS; And yes, that's most likely stupid I know. Sometime what's used is
>>> not always what make sense for other reason that are stupid.
>>>

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Stuart Henderson
In reply to this post by Daniel Ouellet
On 2020-06-23, Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:

> OpenBSD does run on some old Cisco routers, it's been done before. Sure
> it's not officially supported nor does it support all the various
> interfaces but it's known to work on some.
>
> I am trying to dig up a dmesg showing it too.
>
> Plus Cisco have some firewall type of device that are over price PC that
> can run OpenBSD.
>
> Here is an example using the4 old Cisco IDS-4215
>
> https://komlositech.wordpress.com/2018/12/30/revive-a-cisco-ids-into-a-capable-openbsd-firewall/
>
> I was just curious as to what stage it might be now.

That's just someone reusing janky old hardware that is being thrown out,
there is no particular effort to support it on the OpenBSD side.

> I am not saying it make sense to do really power wise for sure.
>
> May be Juniper instead as Juniper is based on FreeBSD anyway and it's an
> over price PC with specialize network cards. (; Ok more then that, but
> you get the picture I think.

they're devices with network forwarding ASICs that happen to use a
FreeBSD system as the control plane (and are moving to Linux now but
I digress).. networking on the control plane is really limited and
only meant for management, beyond that you need to interface with
the special hardware.

>> On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 5:03 PM Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> I also know there was effort and some Cisco router can run OpenBSD very
>>> well, however I have no clue as to any of this stand now.

Not really "effort" or "very well" ;)

>>> I don't have a problem to use APU type or other Ubiquit for small
>>> OpenBSD router, but I wonder about using Cisco instead. The only reason
>>> is for may be more stability, most likely less performance for sure, but
>>> less change to have corrupted reboot on power lost, etc.

That is nonsense, "corrupted reboot on power lost" isn't down to the
hardware, it's OS/configuration - running OpenBSD on such hardware won't
help unless you make a custom system that avoids live writes to the
storage devices or at least reduce the risk with sync mounts etc
(see recent misc@ thread).

>>> And sadly for some customers having what they see as computer as router
>>> don't make them fell good,

Now that is true ...

>>>                            but seeing a Cisco box kind of wipe out the
>>> impression.

paint the chassis blue-green and put a sticker on it? ;)

>>>             I am not saying it's justify, but perception is sometime
>>> everything, but if I have my say in it I want all my routers to be
>>> OpenBSD as much as I can where the needs is not to multiple Gb in speed.
>>>
>>> So, any suggestion or updates as to what's now available and hopefully
>>> in use now.

Have a look through https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/embedded/servers /
https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/embedded/rackmount and you'll find
quite a few things that give the perception "solid custom network device"
rather than either "repurposed server" or "cisco junk, well past it's
sell-by date, <$100 on ebay" - things like these

https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/system/1U/1019/SYS-1019D-FRN8TP.cfm
https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/system/1U/5019/SYS-5019D-4C-FN8TP.cfm

(some equipment from other vendors will fit the bill too, but supermicro is
a lot easier to buy from than portwell etc).

>>> I just have no clue if wireguard needs to be run, what can be achieve as
>>> the CPU in all Cisco device is always under power, we all know that.

Wireguard performance is pretty good even on relatively weak CPUs but the
20-year-old Celeron in that Cisco thing is ... well ... let's just say it's
going to struggle to forward at 100Mb/s *without* encryption.


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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Kaya Saman-2
On 6/24/20 11:58 AM, Stuart Henderson wrote:

> On 2020-06-23, Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
> <snip>
> Have a look through https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/embedded/servers /
> https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/embedded/rackmount and you'll find
> quite a few things that give the perception "solid custom network device"
> rather than either "repurposed server" or "cisco junk, well past it's
> sell-by date, <$100 on ebay" - things like these
>
> https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/system/1U/1019/SYS-1019D-FRN8TP.cfm
> https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/system/1U/5019/SYS-5019D-4C-FN8TP.cfm
>
> (some equipment from other vendors will fit the bill too, but supermicro is
> a lot easier to buy from than portwell etc).


I agree totally here with Stuart! In the past I have built a router
using a SuperMicro 4U chassis with Xeon E5 cpu.


https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/chassis/4U/842/SC842TQC-668B


Originally OpenBSD didn't support the RAID controller so I used the root
backup cron dd script. Everything else was fine however, and it's
performance has been incredible with the only downtime being during
maintenance periods -> transitioning to new version of 'Current'.

Consequently it is tied to a Cisco router :-)

That is really only to bridge the VDSL2 line to Ethernet -
https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1483


Another option depending on availability could be Jetway -

http://www.jetwayipc.com/product-category/emb-board-en/embedded-x86-en/mini-itx-en/

https://www.jetwaycomputer.com/


Example (yes they do look like vendor based network equipment and not
rack mount servers):
https://www.jetwaycomputer.com/1U-Rackmount-Barebones.html


One common place for their availability is the Mini-ITX store:
https://www.mini-itx.com/store/category?type=motherboard&jetway=1&maxram=4GB-or-more&lan-ports=from-1&storage-ports=from-1&sortby=price&page=1


I don't have experience with them in general but if OpenBSD works well
on them they could become a really big game changer.


Regards,


Kaya

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Pierre Emeriaud
In reply to this post by Stuart Henderson
Le mer. 24 juin 2020 à 13:01, Stuart Henderson <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> On 2020-06-23, Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > OpenBSD does run on some old Cisco routers, it's been done before. Sure
> > it's not officially supported nor does it support all the various
> > interfaces but it's known to work on some.

Not a router per se, but my home gateway is a Cisco ACE 4710 appliance
running 6.6, with multiple rdomains, tinc vpns, bgp full ipv6 table
and a couple of nics, and a 4GB cf as harddisk.

> > I am trying to dig up a dmesg showing it too.

https://dmesgd.nycbug.org/index.cgi?do=view&id=4760

> > Here is an example using the4 old Cisco IDS-4215
> >
> > https://komlositech.wordpress.com/2018/12/30/revive-a-cisco-ids-into-a-capable-openbsd-firewall/
> >
> > I was just curious as to what stage it might be now.
>
> That's just someone reusing janky old hardware that is being thrown out,
> there is no particular effort to support it on the OpenBSD side.

My hardware is really ancient compared to modern servers:
$ sysctl hw.model
hw.model=Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.40GHz

It draws power for sure, much more than an APU or similar, but I like it :)

The install was straightforward, install on the CF from another host
w/ qemu, plug, boot, done.

> > May be Juniper instead as Juniper is based on FreeBSD anyway and it's an
> > over price PC with specialize network cards. (; Ok more then that, but
> > you get the picture I think.
>
> they're devices with network forwarding ASICs that happen to use a
> FreeBSD system as the control plane (and are moving to Linux now but
> I digress).. networking on the control plane is really limited and
> only meant for management, beyond that you need to interface with
> the special hardware.

The Cisco ACE4710 had a specialized nic, a cavium (octeon?), running
linux on a mips cpu, to offload all the heavy lifting. I removed it
and never tried to use it.

I also tried to install 5.sth on a nokia IP 710 firewall, that didn't
go that well because of some pci & acpi issues iirc, and overall it
was less interesting because of the huge form factor, and the
linecards beeing proprietary.

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Re: Any idea/suggestion for old Cisco router to be use running OpenBSD current for WG?

Pedro Caetano
The hardware is good.

After an AC incident, I've had some of those cavium nics melt the cpu
thermal paste, dripping all over the mainboard. (this nics are inserted
into a riser card, facing down the mainboard)

The machine kept running!




A quarta, 24/06/2020, 21:12, Pierre Emeriaud <[hidden email]>
escreveu:

> Le mer. 24 juin 2020 à 13:01, Stuart Henderson <[hidden email]> a
> écrit :
> >
> > On 2020-06-23, Daniel Ouellet <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > OpenBSD does run on some old Cisco routers, it's been done before. Sure
> > > it's not officially supported nor does it support all the various
> > > interfaces but it's known to work on some.
>
> Not a router per se, but my home gateway is a Cisco ACE 4710 appliance
> running 6.6, with multiple rdomains, tinc vpns, bgp full ipv6 table
> and a couple of nics, and a 4GB cf as harddisk.
>
> > > I am trying to dig up a dmesg showing it too.
>
> https://dmesgd.nycbug.org/index.cgi?do=view&id=4760
>
> > > Here is an example using the4 old Cisco IDS-4215
> > >
> > >
> https://komlositech.wordpress.com/2018/12/30/revive-a-cisco-ids-into-a-capable-openbsd-firewall/
> > >
> > > I was just curious as to what stage it might be now.
> >
> > That's just someone reusing janky old hardware that is being thrown out,
> > there is no particular effort to support it on the OpenBSD side.
>
> My hardware is really ancient compared to modern servers:
> $ sysctl hw.model
> hw.model=Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.40GHz
>
> It draws power for sure, much more than an APU or similar, but I like it :)
>
> The install was straightforward, install on the CF from another host
> w/ qemu, plug, boot, done.
>
> > > May be Juniper instead as Juniper is based on FreeBSD anyway and it's
> an
> > > over price PC with specialize network cards. (; Ok more then that, but
> > > you get the picture I think.
> >
> > they're devices with network forwarding ASICs that happen to use a
> > FreeBSD system as the control plane (and are moving to Linux now but
> > I digress).. networking on the control plane is really limited and
> > only meant for management, beyond that you need to interface with
> > the special hardware.
>
> The Cisco ACE4710 had a specialized nic, a cavium (octeon?), running
> linux on a mips cpu, to offload all the heavy lifting. I removed it
> and never tried to use it.
>
> I also tried to install 5.sth on a nokia IP 710 firewall, that didn't
> go that well because of some pci & acpi issues iirc, and overall it
> was less interesting because of the huge form factor, and the
> linecards beeing proprietary.
>
>